|
|
|||
|
Navigation User login Who's online There are currently 5 users and 21 guests online.
Online users
Support OlyBlog OlyBlog is run by volunteers who care about Olympia. If you like what we're doing, make a donation: OlyBlog is powered by:
Who's new
 |
Submitted by chad360 on Thu, 02/22/2007 - 2:11pm.
this sure suprised me!
» Jeez, after looking at that dude's camp I was curious if he was gonna get charged...who is "at large" freaks me out! in the ZERO
|
OlyBlog.net OlyBlog is devoted to citizen journalism, including hyperlocal news and discussion specifically about Olympia, Washington. If you care about this community and are tired of corporate media, then this is the place for you. If you'd like to contribute, please register for an account. Here is a list of local news beats that need to be covered. You can post your news as a personal blog entry, and it will be reviewed (and possibly edited) for promotion to the front page. Once you've established a record of responsible blogging, you can become an autonomous user. You can also send news via email. All members of OlyBlog agree to abide by our comment and fair use policies. If you are frustrated about something said in a comment thread, go here. Now playing at: 
Latest Classified Ads Upcoming events
 
|
|
|
More Flickr photos tagged with "olympia" and "washington" OlyBlog is a site for news and discussion about Olympia, Washington. |
|||
I posted this in the other
Submitted by Norm on Thu, 02/22/2007 - 4:23pm.I posted this in the other thread too, but I was really not sure that they had the right guy, given the young girls description vs what this man looks like.
He's off the hook for this one but after being in western I'm sure that they'll find a reason to keep him there for awhile. Hopefully something good comes out of this for him. I don't know the facility well enough to provide any input though. After reading the Olympians comments though, I'm glad Oly doesn't have it's own "posse".
Olympia's finest..
Submitted by bubba z (not verified) on Thu, 02/22/2007 - 6:40pm.Yeah Norm, me too. Unfortunately, we did have some of the baseless horrible commentary, normally reserved for the Olympian Comments Section, show up here on Olyblog.
For example:
Submitted by OlyCop on Sat, 02/10/2007 - 7:39pm.
"given the Lynch rape, and his homeless status, it's not completely off the mark."
"So you don't take issue with the second verse, "Snot running down his nose, greasy fingers smearing shabby clothes"?.."
.........................................................................................................................................
This case is a terrible situation involving a (still) unsolved rape of a young girl, and a (now) innocent person with psychological issues.I took one look at the horrible things being said on the Olympian Comments Section regarding this case and was out of there.
There were nut cases on that comment section who were calling for this kid to be hung, before any trial mind you.
The "moderators" just let it all happen.
Just a sad exploitation of the whole tragedy..
We all need to do our part here on Olyblog to make sure that this sort of baseless horrible commentary, normaly reserved for the Olympian Comments Section, does not end up here on Olyblog.
Anymore..
Although I understand your
Submitted by Norm on Thu, 02/22/2007 - 7:03pm.Although I understand your point, I'm not sure I agree with your quotes. The first quote, if I remember the thread right, could easily be taken out of context in this thread now. The second quote was asking a question about song lyrics. Is the song talking about a homeless person? I could be looking at this from the wrong view, I'm not sure. Either way it's no longer my game, you have the "thread-ending stick" not me.
Obviously this young guy didn't commit the crime. I'm certainly glad he isn't living in his hideaway any longer though. Judging by his diary he needed some help and that help was either not sought out, or refused. Again, hopefully some good comes of this.
What really gets me though, is that this man did not fit the girls description, yet they charged him, threw it all over the news and had a circus with the damn thing. Part of me wonders if it's due to his being homeless, I think more than likely it had to do with his writings though. Still, it seemed like they nabbed him and did the whole "case closed, let's go have a beer to celebrate!" before any of the preliminary tests were back. That's possibly just my interpretation from the media coverage though. Hopefully they stay on top of this, and keep from cheering before the job is done.
RE: "I'm not sure I agree with your quotes..."
Submitted by Anonymous on Thu, 02/22/2007 - 7:39pm.what I see is someone from the Olympia Police Department, coming on to Olyblog, and falsely claiming that this man raped that poor girl.
The quote clearly says "Lynch rape"
its unambiguous..
Its also the only time Lynch was mentioned on this blog by name..
All of this means that this baseless horrible quote is completely relevant to this particular discussion here, and on top of that, is also inappropriate for this venue, given: the setting (Olyblog), circumstances (a still unresolved rape case), and the position of the person saying it, namely a representative of the Olympia Police Department.
Heh
Submitted by Norm on Thu, 02/22/2007 - 8:09pm.I think I misread that top quote. I'm not sure how I missed that, it adds nicely to my long day though. I'll give you that one, it's a clear quote. Anyone on this blog care to admit that they thought the same thing? Given the media coverage I'll be there's at least a few. Besides, we don't know the girl's name, and he was the prime suspect, arrested and convicted all over the olympian and komo 4 news.
As for being a rep for OPD. C'mon, so now the guy can't talk without it being the official voice of OPD? So if I get hired as a cop will I not be able to talk on the blog without it being the official word of the agency that employs me? When I talk now am I officially speaking for Sister of Providence or St. Peter Hospital? Are you the official voice for your place of work? Are cops always on duty?
I think if there is one constant, within this blog, it is the huge bias toward law enforcement. NO other profession could be pissed upon in this blog like that one can. It's getting a little tiring at best. Do you wonder why cops have their "thin blue line" and they have few friends outside of the law enforcement circle, do you? Read your post above, and if you can still ask me that question I'll buy you a beer when we meet Bub. Read anything posted by Drew.....anything, and if you can ask me that question I'll buy you another beer. I can name a handful of others (Drew is tough, I know he can handle me calling his name) but I'm not going to name them. I just find it so amazing, that outside of the blog, my friends, my family, my general social circle, all have so much respect for anyone willing to do that job. Yet I can come on here and I'm up to my elbows in bullshit about cops.
Again, doesn't make a bit of difference Bub, you're the one with the stick. Remember though that a troll always has to be fed, and sometimes the person feeding the troll ends up being more troll'ish than the original.
EDITED: 8:36pm 2/22/07 becuz I canknot speel wurth a dern.
Norm..
Submitted by bubba z (not verified) on Thu, 02/22/2007 - 8:37pm.You seemed to care if the quote was relevant or not.
It is..
And in my opinion, systematic of something even more disturbing than trolls on Olyblog.
Ive said my part, im out..
Come on, Norm. There are
Submitted by Mike on Fri, 02/23/2007 - 3:24pm.And if you posted here as brother of providence, we would see you self-identifying as your work identity. Olycop makes a choice when he chooses his name here. If JT talks about the Lynch rape that is qualitatively different than if Olycop posts about it here. It's not an official voice thing, but a a significant self-identification.
as for the "up to elbows in bullshit about cops here," it reminds me of the talk about all the vomit and feces on the sidewalks and alleys downtown... it's an interesting political gambit, but I don't know if it stands up to scrutiny.
You have said in the other thread that you had doubts about this arrest because the description was such a poor match. Why could you spot something that the Oly PD and prosecutor and the Zero missed so dramatically? My hat is off to you on that. I don't see that as cop-bashing, but another reasonable person might view it that way. I think you are flailing a little when you start on the "pissing on" and "bullshit" stuff. I think that kind of language exacerbates the problems and obscures possible solutions.
But maybe I am just up to my elbows in a different kind of bullshit? You follow?
True, there are some unique
Submitted by Norm on Fri, 02/23/2007 - 7:52pm.True, there are some unique issues with working in law enforcement. Part of their job is sometimes having to do things that harm people. On the job, they have to do many things that normally aren't tolerated within society. Usually when there is cause to question their moves, they are removed from duty. This is all "on the job" things, and as such I agree with you.
Here's the thing, even if I came on as "PTboy" or "PhysTher" nobody is automatically going to assume that my word is the official thought of physical therapists in the area. I'm sure this is why olycop didn't provide his identity for so long. As soon as he speaks it turns into a cop representation thing. He took a gamble and some folks have latched onto that. Olycop could mean = patrolman who lives in oly (state cop), deputy that lives in oly (county cop), corrections officer who lives in oly (state or county cop). He let go of some information and now he's considered a rep for OPD. I'm sorry, but I don't believe that is just. Everyone needs to unwind, everyone needs to be "off the job" and everyone needs to be able to express their opinion without having it attached to their job.
"I don't know if it stands up to scrutiny."
Unfortunately I don't have time right now. Considering this is my remark though, I will pull up some quotes from threads when I get home.
Police had reason to detain the subject. He was living illegaly on public land, no? Should they have arrested him? Probably. It doesn't sound like he was an easy guy to interview, so I'm sure until they sorted out whether or not he was involved they chose to arrest him. What charges he was arrested for, I'm not sure. Either way authorities needed to figure out what he was doing living in a hole in the woods. As for the prosecutor and the olympian. I assume it's a PR thing. They caught their man and they wanted to parade around like a couple of peacocks. All the while trying to figure out how a girl who was just raped confused a man with short hair, with a man with long hair.
To be continued.....
"You have said in the other thread that you had doubts about this arrest because the description was such a poor match. Why could you spot something that the Oly PD and prosecutor and the Zero missed so dramatically? My hat is off to you on that. I don't see that as cop-bashing, but another reasonable person might view it that way. I think you are flailing a little when you start on the "pissing on" and "bullshit" stuff. I think that kind of language exacerbates the problems and obscures possible solutions"
I did have doubts about, not necessarily the arrest, but him being charged so quickly when he didn't match the description. I realize rape is a terrible thing, it makes me cringe even thinking about it. I also know that, in a sick and twisted way, it's intimate. In the sense that you are physically close to this other person. SHE would know if the guy had long hair or short hair! She said it was short! This guy is a pale white boy with long hair! Something isn't adding up. So, because it's not adding up let's not charge him with the rape until we get a little more evidence together. I realize he also had different shade of skin, but low light can change the perception there. The assailant had a mustache and goatee, which could have been shaved. The hair thing is tough though, how do you grow hair overnight? Maybe OPD spotted it, maybe they didn't, maybe they were in a rush to catch their man. How the prosecutor handled it seems kind of shotty to me. How the media handled it, in my opinion, is downright disgraceful.
Maybe some would consider those thoughts to be cop bashing. My point behind all of it is reserving judgement and not jumping to conclusions.
As for my swearing, I wished to be a little more colorful. I apologize if my demonstration offended you
"But maybe I am just up to my elbows in a different kind of bullshit?"
Aren't you always?
"You follow?"
Not really, but it could be by choice, I'm not sure. It's been long week, friday was the cherry on top. I received great news when I got home though so that's always a plus. I'll start looking for my "anti-cop" material later tonight.
Norm, It is not a bias
Submitted by yogi woman on Fri, 02/23/2007 - 9:46pm.It is not a bias towards cops. You come from a background that feels safe and secure and holds police officers in high esteem. This is not true for all of us. Lots of people, including myself, do not feel safe around cops. Does this mean that all cops will beat my ass like Rodney King? No, of course not. But I still don't feel comfortable around them. Reading most of Oly Cop's comments just reaffirms my mistrust in police officers.
Definition of Bias
Submitted by Norm on Sat, 02/24/2007 - 10:11am.So, if a cop comes and knocks on your door, and you get nervous because he/she is there, does that make you biased? You are using your experience with a few officers, to paint the whole profession as being that way.
What I was talking about, was more of the bad-mouthing of law enforcement in general. Again I will find some text on the blog to support my idea....or I'll fail miserably. I afforded myself almost an hour to sleep in today before work so I'm still a bit cloudy. Stay tuned.
LMAO
Submitted by OlyCop on Fri, 02/23/2007 - 10:42pm.Mike and bubbaz, you guys are so predictable. I expected this from 3 bloggers here, and you guys were 2 of the 3. A little disappointed it took so long though. :)
"Among the many misdeeds of the British rule in India, history will look upon the act of depriving a whole nation of arms, as the blackest." (emphasis added) ~~ Mahatma Gandhi
I wonder who the third could
Submitted by Ehver Green on Fri, 02/23/2007 - 3:51pm.I wonder who the third could be?
I lost sleep over this case OC..
Submitted by Anonymous on Fri, 02/23/2007 - 4:27pm.I didn't lose any sleep over
Submitted by Norm on Fri, 02/23/2007 - 6:15pm.I didn't lose any sleep over it, but it sure did puzzle me. Maybe it's because I actually looked at him while in custody and he just didn't look like the right person. Beyond physical description he just didn't look capable of slipping into that house and doing that. Considering his little shelter though, he's obviously a pretty capable person.
Hopefully they find the right guy. Hopefully he's not a houseless man, which I admit is my own selfish reasoning there. Hopefully this girl can have some closure. Hopefully the media doesn't have a field day all over again, and if the person is houseless, hopefully they don't latch onto that.
Norm..
Submitted by Anonymous on Fri, 02/23/2007 - 6:42pm.You want to become a cop..
Does it take almost three weeks to come up with a composite sketch?
Was OPD waiting until the DNA results came in for some reason, before releasing a composite sketch?
Three weeks?
I have lots of children in my neighborhood, and a child of my own..
This information should have been released weeks ago, not today..
I am completely disgusted with both OPD and The Olympian right now..
(Olycop: Dont talk to me anymore on this board. I have nothing more to say to you.)
Not going as I hoped
Submitted by Norm on Sat, 02/24/2007 - 6:24pm.You want to become a cop.. Correct
Does it take almost three weeks to come up with a composite sketch? I hope not, I'm not artist though. Maybe....and it's a stretch.....the girl was having a hard time describing him until now?
Was OPD waiting until the DNA results came in for some reason, before releasing a composite sketch? Not a clue. Again, I hope not.
My comment of not losing sleep was not meant to poke at you, and I hope you understand that. My tune may change when I have a wife/girlfriend or eventually a child. At this point the only people near me that I worry about are my neighbors, and my upstairs neighbors (girls I went to highschool with). I hope that they all know if they need something they can knock on my door at 4am.
I stress though, that we shouldn't be angry with ALL of opd though. If a few of the protesters at the port came from evergreen, would it be a good idea for us to be upset with the school as a whole? Of course not, but for some reason it's completely acceptable to do this with public services. Beat cops have no control over the public release of a sketch. Want to get mad? Fire a letter off at the chief, go to the next chief's forums. Ask him why investigators hadn't released the sketch as soon as it was available, or if it wasn't available, why didn't the start the sketch earlier?
Anyway, I hope you start getting some sleep.
Very interesting bubbaz
Submitted by OlyCop on Fri, 02/23/2007 - 8:11pm.painting with that broad brush that you take offense to when talking about the poor or homeless. You are disgusted with OPD, so don't talk to you....nice!
And bubbaz you bring up my quote/comments of lyrics from a Jethro Tull song, which I indicated in that thread that it was my attempt at humor. In fact you threw some humor back my way and referenced me as being "thick as a brick". Yes, my humor was not received well by those close to the issue (which I don't believe you are, those that work with the homeless on a daily basis) and I appologized to them, Rob, Phil, and the PPU. Yet you feel it is important to continue to use it to paint me in a bad light.
As far as not talking to you, that's your call, but you don't get to throw barbs at me and not expect to have some come back your way.
As far as the child rape investigation, none of us here have all the inside info, including me. It's not my investigation, further, my team wasn't even working when the crime occurred, nor when Lynch was arrested. And none of us know what all the info was they (the investigating detectives) had for the probable cause for Lynch's arrest. But not only the cops felt they had P/C, but so did the prosecutors, and the judges. Yes, he was the wrong guy. Not the first time in history this has happened. Guys have gone to prision for long periods of time for crimes they didn't commit. Luckily it was found out very soon in Lynch's case he wasn't the guy. Not only for Lynch, but also for the public so efforts can be made to get the right guy in custody.
Burden of proof has different levels. There is reasonable suspicion, probable cause, preponderance, and proof beyond a reasonable doubt, the 4 main ones. If you were to assess a percent amount of the chance someone was guilt for each, it would be somewhere like this. 15-20% for reasonable suspicion, 30-40% for P/C, 51% for prepronderance, and about 80% for proof beyond a reasonable doubt. Lynch was arrested for P/C, based on the evidence at the time, 30-40% chance. Many times after an arrest, evidence gathering continues, because you may not have enough to convict at the time of an arrest. Sometimes you have enough, but sometimes you don't. In this case the evidence cleared a suspect. That is a good thing and shows the system worked. If it bothers you that Lynch was arrested and deprived his liberty for only P/C 30-40%, know that in some states they can take you into custody on reasonable suspicion for up to 72 hours, only 15-20%. (percentages are for discussion rather than a offical legal amount. Easier than giving the language for each, but are a fair representation of the amounts)
There are lots of things about this case that people looking in don't like. Heck, there are many cops on the department that don't like things about how this case has played out. But you can be sure that the investigators involved in this case are working hard to get the right guy into custody. And they are doing so without concern for their own egos or pride. If they were self-centered like that, do you think they would have put out the composite sketch of the suspect knowing the comments that would come about the differences in appearance between him and Lynch? They didn't have to do that, but did so to better arm the public to help with the search for this guy and for the public to better protect themselves.
"Among the many misdeeds of the British rule in India, history will look upon the act of depriving a whole nation of arms, as the blackest." (emphasis added) ~~ Mahatma Gandhi
Bottom line...
Submitted by Anonymous on Sat, 02/24/2007 - 4:48am.Lets look at this one more time:
Lets remember: this was posted, by you, on a homeless encampment thread. Not even a thread regarding this particular case."given the Lynch rape, and his homeless status, it's not completely off the mark."
Personally, im trying real hard right now not to write you off as just a troll. You dont seem to care about this board or the people on it. fuck the docent shit. These are my own sentiments.
The fact that you find this case, and the plight of the unfortunate, amusing, is nothing I can control. Just know that I cannot have any respect for you, because of the way you conduct yourself on this board.
Also, we both know full well that the members of the Olympia Police Department were convinced it was this Lynch guy the whole time.
If they weren't, then the sketch would have been released to the public at large weeks ago, not today, after the DNA test.
Whatever bubbaz
Submitted by OlyCop on Sat, 02/24/2007 - 4:04am.do what ya gotta do.
It's clear you got it all figured out.
The only thing I find amusing is you and how you respond to things on this board.
"Among the many misdeeds of the British rule in India, history will look upon the act of depriving a whole nation of arms, as the blackest." (emphasis added) ~~ Mahatma Gandhi
Here's what I find funny or
Submitted by Merwyn Haskett on Sat, 02/24/2007 - 12:15pm.Here on Olyblog I've noticed the word Troll is used for anyone that has a different thought, belief, idea or suggestion. You can agree with 95% of a discussion, but deviate on one or two points then you're flayed, crucified, and being trollish.
Perhaps besides having a mission statement concerning citizen journalists Olyblog should have a statement of beliefs, not using broad words concerning Rights and Respect but being specific. We believe cars should be outlawed. We believe in a person's right not to work. We believe Christians are evil, except for the misinformed who might be saved from their folly. We believe in an artist's right to vandalize. It'd be easier to know what's accepted if that was posted, or at least linked to, in the side column.
I love your last paragraph -
Submitted by Ehver Green on Sat, 02/24/2007 - 9:18pm.I love your last paragraph - especially giving an artist the right to vandalize. I can't believe what I read on that thread.
If bubbaz says I'm a troll, then I'm a troll. Then what? Nothing... I'm not really worried about that dude - seems to be a commonality amongst us who disagree with him.
Don't give everyone on here the credit Merwyn...
Submitted by chad360 on Thu, 03/01/2007 - 7:43am.I think cars should be banned, and this is not the opinion of all OlyBloggers (be real!).
ME, that is MY point of view! MINE, as in "made up my own mind".
I LIVE MY LIFE THAT WAY! (too many caps for you?)
Maybe you just don't like having opinions/beliefs that are in the minority or at least are not reinforced/shared by many on this blog...I dunno, I see your posts and wonder what your point is.
While you are at it, instead of just ripping my LIFESTYLE CHOICES, why don't you convince me that cars should not be made illegal-- isn't oil why the US is at war? oil for fuel for autos?
I swear "me not using gas during the war as much as I would (as most do) has had more impact than the port protests BS", and I constantly get sh*t for trying to ride a bike! what gives?
--why do you make such a bid deal about the car/bike issue? You like the automotive industry or something? love pollution? I'm "curious in Oly"
Bike away, what do I care?
Submitted by Merwyn Haskett on Thu, 03/01/2007 - 2:43pm.As for "Maybe you just don't like having opinions/beliefs that are in the minority or at least are not reinforced/shared by many on this blog" last time I checked I'm in the minority on Olyblog, at least from the vocal crew. If I were to go full-out and post my complete spiel on being Pro-Life you'd see very quickly just how badly in the minority I'm in.
While you are at it, instead of just ripping my LIFESTYLE CHOICES, why don't you convince me that cars should not be made illegal-- isn't oil why the US is at war? oil for fuel for autos?
Well, how about you also refrain from ripping my LIFESTYLE CHOICES. Oil isn't the only reason Republicans are sending the sheep off to die. If the mere fact that Bush's greed for oil profits is enough reason to give up driving cars then by that logic his hatred for Islam should be reason enough to denounce that lifestyle and culture here.
I don't know who's giving you sh!t for riding a bike. Like I said, ride away. All I ask is that you follow the rules of the road. Oh, and of course, be careful, it's often dark out there.
why do you make such a bid deal about the car/bike issue?
The only thing I make a big deal about is the very vocal bikers, mainly represented on this board, who believe that they have the right to ride their bike in any fashion whatsoever, who feel that rules and laws don't apply to them, and who disregard their own safety and then are quick to point fingers when an accident happens. The ones who wear black at night without lights, reflectors or helmets. The ones who weave through traffic, cut through red lights, and don't yield for pedestrians in a crosswalk.
I'm just as disgusted with drivers who exhibit the same attitude. Those who speed, race the yellow lights, ignore pedestrians in crosswalks, take up two parking spots, refuse to get a tune up when their exhaust is black with burning oil, etc.
Do you suggest that my fiance ride a bike to her chemo? Or that someone else prop her up on their handlebars to get her there? She could quit her job (afterall it would take a sick woman, weak from a steadily declining red blood cell count, a long time to bike from Shelton to Olympia, but who needs an income, she could just move to Camp Quixote, right?)
Like herding cats...
Submitted by Phil Owen on Thu, 03/01/2007 - 12:20pm.Regarding comments on the "beliefs" of Olyblog... THIS IS A PUBLIC FORUM! There are a lot of beliefs being expressed here, and sometimes the more extreme ones get a lot more attention.
All someone has to do is say in caps, "F*%K THE PIGS, TEAR DOWN THE PORT!, or "ABORTIONISTS ARE MURDERERS", and all of a sudden we have a very lively and heated debate with a whole lot of comments. The voice of moderation provokes little conversation here, because it offers little to argue with and is, frankly, boring.
I have also noticed a growing tendency on this blog to mischaracterize the beliefs of others. This is not fair play. Worse than that, it drags down the quality of discourse and creates personal resentments in place of political disagreements.
I take particular exception to the suggestion that Olyblog believes that "Christians are evil". I am adamantly and openly Christian. While Rob Richards and I have had some heated debate on religion, THE MOST inflammatory thing anyone has said to me on Olyblog about my faith was when one fellow Christian here on the blog accused my church of "apostacy" for its attempt at practicing full inclusion of gays. (I took no offense, by the way.)
I think there are a lot of people here who are uncomfortable with the open expression of faith. That does not mean that they think that faith is evil.
I would also hesitate to blame them for their discomfort. We Christians have a history that includes a lot of things that could, and should, make people feel deeply uncomfortable. I think we have a long road of repentance to walk before we can expect anyone to feel warm and fuzzy about our faith.
No one here, that I know of, has ever advocated for a "person's right not to work". I have advocated, in many forums, for a person's right to work and to refuse pay. But this is very different from advocating laziness. Rather, it advocates non-cooperation with an evil economic system that has selfishness for a foundation. Hard work, generosity, and steadfast love ought to be the underpinnings for a more just system, and I'll not hesitate to promote any of these virtues.
We also need to be much more careful about name-calling on the blog. I have been horrified to see Norm and Olycop called “Trolls” over and over again. Often times the person flinging the accusation hasn’t even been around the blog for half as long as the accused. If we continue the practice of personal attacks on those we disagree with, I think we will soon find this to be a very homogenous, very boring “forum” in which everyone gets to preach to the choir.
More importantly, I have found a kind of strange fellowship with these two on the blog. We disagree about a lot, but I really value their input, and we seem to have gotten along well. I believe that the value of relationships between people is far greater than the value of our bullshit politics. Politics are an abstraction, people are real. It is shameful that this forum has allowed political acrimony to prevent people on the forum from coming closer together.
The Canaanite's CallThe christians are evil thing
Submitted by Mike on Thu, 03/01/2007 - 12:59pm.It's possible that they are authentic attempts to communicate, but if so, the perspective is generalized and stereotyped and not particularly useful imho.
I am on other lists where trolls just post stupid stuff all the time. I understand those types as classic trolls. I don't think we have trolls in that sense here on Olyblog, but I think there is some trolling going on. We can all slip into it pretty easily. I think the dialogue is better if we choose our words carefully.
wrong
Submitted by Norm on Fri, 03/02/2007 - 5:35pm."I am up to my elbows in bullshit about police and it pisses me off"
that'd be my quote. It was not made to go fishing. It was simply an interjection made out of frustration. Please don't pretend to understand how I think or guess my motives Mike.
Thanks!
The voice of moderation
Submitted by Merwyn Haskett on Thu, 03/01/2007 - 9:06pm.I could see that point, but when Rick, who is the ultimate guy in charge here, calls people whose views he disagrees with Sports Bloggers, and who feels that people shouldn't comment unless they're going to agree, then it suggests that Olyblog does in fact have official views on subjects. If people are asked not to disagree then the website should list what is expected.
No one here, that I know of, has ever advocated for a "person's right not to work".
Rob suggested it here.
More importantly, I have found a kind of strange fellowship with these two [Norm and Olycop] on the blog. We disagree about a lot, but I really value their input, and we seem to have gotten along well.
I don't know that I'm close enough to claim fellowship but I like both of them too and value their input on issues. I don't mind when the police are called to answer for their actions but I don't like it when Olycop is automatically untrusted or despised just because of his job.
Actually Rob didn't suggest it.
Submitted by Phil Owen on Thu, 03/01/2007 - 9:59pm.Here's a review of the comments you linked to regarding Rob's statement.
Merwyn said: The thing is, homelessness isn't a genetic condition. I agree that addicts and the disabled need services before they can move forward. For the rest there's no reason why they can't.
Roses Advocacy Center
There is nothing here that comes anywhere close to implying a "right to not work". Rob simply suggested that the "bootstrap" method isn't as accessible as many people would suggest.I also reviewed the entire thread you referred to. I gotta say, Merwyn, that sometimes your opinions about what other people are saying are so loud that others can't communicate with you. It's like if you said to me, "I like apples", and I asked you "why the hell don't you like oranges!?" Then you get defensive and say, "All I said was..." and I cut you off with "oranges are good too!"
Had you listened a little closer on that thread, you might have learned a little more about how a Tent City could help folks who have been strenuously trying the bootstrap method.
The Canaanite's Call
I see that the communication
Submitted by Mike on Fri, 03/02/2007 - 3:13pm.I encourage everyone to recognize the difference between facts and beliefs, to read and write carefully, to strive to be understandable and understood and not to misunderstand others accidentally or deliberately as a debating gambit. I think if we are going to debate, we should debate the important stuff and be ethical about the debate process.
Nothing was misrepresented.
Submitted by Merwyn Haskett on Fri, 03/02/2007 - 7:32am.It was never satisfactorily
Submitted by Merwyn Haskett on Fri, 03/02/2007 - 7:29am.He is able to be fed everyday. He has access to showers and laundry. He is able to use BnR's address. Why then is he not capable to read the classifieds, visit the temp agencies, etc? Yes temp jobs suck, yes general labor sucks, yes he still can't make longterm plans for the future until he lands something more stable, but the odds are against him landing a sweet nine-to-five with bennies at the snap of his fingers.
I still don't have medical but I'm working anyway.
If you'll remember I was in complete support of tent city at first, and it won't take much to sway me back. What turned me off was the idea that they wanted the city to GIVE them five acres (when land is at a premium here) so that Healthy and Able John Doe can live on a farm and not need to become part of the workforce.
If the idea was that it was for those who truly can't hold down a job then I'd have never had that much of a problem.
Jumping to conclusions.
Submitted by Phil Owen on Fri, 03/02/2007 - 5:35pm.For clarity's sake, I will put up a post (by the end of the day) on why tent city is beneficial for those who are capable of gainful employment, also on why it is beneficial for those who can work but are incapable of gainful employment, as well as for those who have little capacity to work. I will also clarify some definitions of "able to work" and "capable of gainful employment". I'll also write a bit about why some might be able-bodied and are homeless.
The Canaanite's Call
I'm looking forward to that.
Submitted by Merwyn Haskett on Fri, 03/02/2007 - 5:42pm.There's no reason Healthy John Doe can't try to work.
That's simply not true.
My question is why not?
for the record
Submitted by Anonymous on Thu, 03/01/2007 - 12:51pm.I never called OC a troll..
I was just upset that he called an innocent person a rapist on Olyblog.
I was mostly horrified of the influence that The Olympians misreporting had on folks in this town.
Hearing the influence of that misreporting coming from a police officer just made me very upset.
Everyone gets upset, and
Submitted by Merwyn Haskett on Thu, 03/01/2007 - 1:12pm.Did you have anyone specific in mind when you posted this?
That definition was accurate but I couldn't apply it to any of the regular posters here.
Merwynn..
Submitted by Anonymous on Thu, 03/01/2007 - 9:37pm.I think that the continual Olyblog bashing is what I had in mind.
Especially, when I keep hearing it over and over again from the same people, for the same reasons.
Olyblog is why we are all here even having this discussion.
We should give this forum some repect..
I promise to try..
I promise too *extends hand
Submitted by Merwyn Haskett on Thu, 03/01/2007 - 9:50pm.I've been critical of Rick. I'd like to point out that I did a little research and was highly impressed. He's got much to admire. Besides, his suggestion that we be less critical isn't bad. If all of us can get over this idea that a viewpoint opposite your own is in itself disruptive, offensive, etc. we'll be in position to make some progress.
I recently looked over some of my older posts and threads and found the New Years Revolutions...I mean Resolutions...and here's my progress as we approach the end of the first quarter: 1. I let myself get heated on Olyblog and butted heads. 2. I've given up McDonalds lunches but still go every morning before work. 3. My overdue library books from September are STILL in the back of my car. I owe Timberland some Collections compensation now. 4. Progress Made in picking up without being nagged 5. Great progress made in cooking foods from scratch and making dishes that make everyone else want me to be in charge of cooking every night.
Sorry, only my first Resolution applied to this thread.
I don't think I ever called Lynch
Submitted by OlyCop on Fri, 03/02/2007 - 8:43pm.a rapist. I'm sure one of you can re-link to what I said, and it may have alluded to his guilt maybe more than you all would like, but I didn't "called him a rapist". I did make a link to Lynch when talking about the homeless and "transient registered sex offenders". Probably an unfair link, since the guy wasn't a "convicted sex offender". But I doubt the PPU would appreciate me outing some of the transient level 1 offenders, or even linking the level 2 and 3 list. I don't know if any of the PPU members are on any of the three lists, but I'm sure they wouldn't like to be outed. I was trying to make a point and used a current event on someone who was on everyone's mind, and it pissed backwards on me. My bad, and several of you slapped me around for it.
I clearly don't take the time that some do here to write at great length with lots of thought, etc. I enjoy participating here, but it is a hobby of sorts. I don't have the desire to give it the amount of time and effort that Mike and others give to their comments or expect of others. None of the issues here are that important to me. Given the topics I have restricted myself to, I doubt there will ever be a topic that is that important to me now.
"Among the many misdeeds of the British rule in India, history will look upon the act of depriving a whole nation of arms, as the blackest." (emphasis added) ~~ Mahatma Gandhi
Thanks.
Submitted by Mike on Fri, 03/02/2007 - 1:30pm.