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Submitted by Rick on Sun, 03/16/2008 - 10:37pm.
The docents met Sunday morning, covering a range of topics. Here is a run down of some of the issues we touched on, and what we are thinking. The fun stuff:
The not-so-fun-but-necessary stuff:
It looks like there are some big changes in our future as we continue this curious experiment into citizen journalism. Thanks to all our contributors and supporters in the community. We're trying to build something that will have lasting value to everyone in Olympia. Let us know if you have ideas about how we could do this better.
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OlyBlog.net OlyBlog is devoted to hyperlocal news and discussion specifically about Olympia, Washington. Contributors to OlyBlog are citizen journalists who care about their community and are tired of corporate media. If you'd like to contribute, please register for an account. Here is a list of local news beats that need to be covered. You can post your news as a personal blog entry, and it will be reviewed (and possibly edited) for promotion to the front page. You can also send news via email. All members of OlyBlog agree to abide by our comment and fair use policies. If you are frustrated about something said in a comment thread, go here. Latest Classified Ads Upcoming events
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Drupal as newspapers....
Submitted by security_six on Sun, 03/16/2008 - 11:01pm.Interesting, but I'm not sure it would work with olyblog. The sites you referenced are places that seem more newspaper like, as opposed to a community generated blog/news site/society page...
Plus the name "blog" doesn't conjure up newspaper layout. The marketing would be all off.
A seperation of various topics is a good idea though. News, opinion (news that relys heavily on opinion in addition to facts would fit there) sports, gossip/society/events/what's happening/items of interest (things that don't quite fit in other places) and maybe a place for people to be unpleasant with each other at times, or an off topic place. Maybe block comments on pure news stories, but enable them for opinion pieces...
Maybe allow individuals to decide if they want comments on their own news articles.
“How many more times are we going to cower under tables and chairs, whimpering like mindless dogs, thinking that someone else has the responsibility to save and protect us?” -Ted Nugent
Marketing?
Submitted by Ehver Green on Sun, 03/16/2008 - 11:17pm.I don't think marketing is a core value when it comes to Olyblog. But, if the plan is to split the site, creating a parallel news site like olynews.net (available), that would be awesome. And, if this is an options I say YES! to ads. Not a ton, but some selected advertising. Why? Think of how nice it would be to give stevenl a proper gift. How nice it would be to pay $25 for a well written local article. Other site comps, too. Let olynews.net pay for olyblog.net.
That's exactly what we're taling about
Submitted by Rob Richards on Mon, 03/17/2008 - 1:18am.How about Underwriters then?
Submitted by Merwyn Haskett on Mon, 03/17/2008 - 7:11am.Marketing
Submitted by security_six on Mon, 03/17/2008 - 11:16am.Perhaps I should have said "Image" Anyway I PM'd some ideas and observations to a couple of movers and shakers here...
Right now OlyBlog is basically the society and gossip page of Olympia, with a bit of hard news thrown in. The problem with the hard news is that it is often tied in with a strong bias to one side or another. I see very little neutral hard news here. JB's article on the PMR meeting was perhaps one of the best written neutral pieces I have seen in some time... I'm working on a couple along those lines myself. OlyBlog will get taken a lot more seriously in the community when there is more unbiased hard news and more effort to seperate opinion from news.
“How many more times are we going to cower under tables and chairs, whimpering like mindless dogs, thinking that someone else has the responsibility to save and protect us?” -Ted Nugent
Unbiased news reporting is somewhat of a myth...
Submitted by Rick on Mon, 03/17/2008 - 11:29am....and doesn't really exist in most other countries.
Do you think Fox News is unbiased, for example? CNN? The Olympian? Check out Media Matters to see what I'm talking about.
If you accept the journalism as conversation model that we've been exploring here, then of course people will have a point of view. However, through the process of discussing events and ideas, something like a neutral position can emerge.
> It's OK to be nice. <
enpen's social contract
I believe
Submitted by security_six on Mon, 03/17/2008 - 12:16pm.That news will have some sort of slant when presented, it's what makes Newspaper X appeal to some people and Newspaper Y appeal to others.
I should have explained a little further. Say there is a major event. A person close to that event writes a piece and gives some facts about the event and describes the event from their perspective. However while describing things from their point of view, they interject their own strong opinion about another partcipant of the event. To me this has stopped being a credible source of news, and has become an opinion piece with some news buried in it. But if this person simply describes the even from their point of view, it becomes a story on XYZ Event as told by a Person Seeing it From This Angle. Said person could then go on as a seperate piece and give their opinion, without sullying the news article with opinion. I'm all for telling from a point of view, and I'm all for opinion, but the two should be seperated.
That's why newspapers have an opinion page seperate from the news page. The newspaper tells the news based on their standards, and in a manner that is palatable to their core market and the public as a whole. They then tell their opinion on another page.
I can think of some great articles here that would have been excellent journalism if stripped of rhetoric and opinion. Not slant, or viewpoint, but rhetoric. If the rhetoric and opinion that was stripped out had then been placed in an opinion piece, it would have been an equally exellent opinion piece.
“How many more times are we going to cower under tables and chairs, whimpering like mindless dogs, thinking that someone else has the responsibility to save and protect us?” -Ted Nugent
Bias vs. polemics
Submitted by Guglielmo on Mon, 03/17/2008 - 12:05pm.What exactly is the World
Submitted by Merwyn Haskett on Mon, 03/17/2008 - 12:09pm.If you were snarking on what I think you were snarking, that "federation" hasn't existed under that name or acronym since Winter '02.
That's when I stopped watching
Submitted by Guglielmo on Mon, 03/17/2008 - 12:18pm.Fox News actually exploited...
Submitted by Rick on Mon, 03/17/2008 - 12:31pm....the news-as-unbiased-reporting environment by changing the rules and beginning to play a different game. It has been to the great detriment of political dialog in this country that the other networks haven't caught up yet (with the possible exception of Keith Olberman). This is all somewhat different from what I'm talking about, though.
What I'm interested in changing is the notion that news is something to be consumed, rather than created. If we are all citizen journalists contributing to the collective knowledge of all, then we are engaged in a fundamentally different manner. We bring our context and bias, but that is checked through the process of conversation, something that doesn't really happen in the mainstream media. Thus, the news-as-conversation model is not as subject to the same kinds of concerns that we would apply to the networks or newspapers which operate on more of a journalist-as-expert model.
> It's OK to be nice. <
enpen's social contract
News creation vs news consumption
Submitted by Guglielmo on Mon, 03/17/2008 - 3:19pm.Thanks Guys
Submitted by stevenl on Mon, 03/17/2008 - 5:34am.Would there be enough
Submitted by DSnyder on Mon, 03/17/2008 - 8:44am.There are several answers to this question.
Submitted by Rick on Mon, 03/17/2008 - 8:51am.One is that we'll never know unless we try.
Another is that, once we split the content, I believe that there will be more motivation for folks to contribute news content. That's because they won't be subject to the kind of acrimony that infects the blogs from time to time, and keeps people out of the game.
Finally, by getting better at pointing folks to important local stories that need to be told, and providing the instruction and tools that people need to tell those stories, we'll see a lot more user-generated content.
> It's OK to be nice. <
enpen's social contract
What would be nice...
Submitted by Tschida on Mon, 03/17/2008 - 8:58am.Tifosi1F1.blogspot.com
One of the great non sequiturs of the left is that, if the free market doesn't work perfectly, then it doesn't work at all-- and the government should step in.
Thomas Sowell
sorry I missed the meeting
Submitted by emmettoconnell on Mon, 03/17/2008 - 9:07am.Thanks for the update,
Submitted by Guglielmo on Mon, 03/17/2008 - 9:35am.Tabs
Submitted by security_six on Mon, 03/17/2008 - 11:29am.On the mainpage, you could promote articles from several categories. The first tab would be news, click on that, and you could see a list of news articles submitted, much like the current tracker view, then opinion, events, what's happening, classified, individual blogs, etc...
The docents could mainly concern themselves with making sure stuff goes in the right place, and monitoring the social contract... Also if news and news coupled with bias or opinion is seperated into news and opinion sections, some of the current problems with comments could be limited. Don't allow commenting on pure news articles. Someone doesn't like it, they start their own opinion thread that is commentable, etc...
“How many more times are we going to cower under tables and chairs, whimpering like mindless dogs, thinking that someone else has the responsibility to save and protect us?” -Ted Nugent
Thanks for reminding me: I
Submitted by Chia on Mon, 03/17/2008 - 10:09pm.---------
Nonviolence Includes Animals:
audio
"PETA President Ingrid E. Newkirk's address to the International Nonviolence Conference in Bethlehem"
Format Choices
Submitted by Chia on Mon, 03/17/2008 - 10:05pm.---------
Nonviolence Includes Animals:
audio
"PETA President Ingrid E. Newkirk's address to the International Nonviolence Conference in Bethlehem"