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Submitted by Ehver Green on Sun, 01/14/2007 - 1:53pm.

As was expected and previously reported on Olyblog, Doug Mah will run for Position #1 in '07 with a Mark Foutch endorsement.  I realize it's a symbolic effort as he already occupies Position #6, but we all know how important symbolism can be!  Right out of the gate other endorsements include Ralph Osgood, the mayor of Tumwater and Virgil Clarkson, the mayor of Lacey (Yelm and Tenino mayors as well).  Also onboard are Reps. Hunt and Williams.  That's a pretty strong endorsement trail.  So much so that I wouldn't be surprised if he goes in unopposed...we'll see.

No word yet from Johnson or Ware.  The article in The Olympian suggested some seat maneuvering.  I suppose this is to find the best races and victory for Johnson and Ware.  Johnson won his last election - but not by a wide margin.  I don't think he's helped his status here in Olympia among undecided voters and may have even pushed away some support with his views and actions.

Rheda Strub, from the Thurston County Planning Commission, would also like a seat on Olympia's City Council.  Given the direction of Thurston County over the past several years, I wonder what the future of Olympia looks like if Johnson and Ware don't run or lose their seats.

»

Mah is vulnerable..


He is way too Anti - Homeless for Olympia..

More and more people are starting to find this out..

»

Taking Mike's words in to

Taking Mike's words in to account, where are your facts - Fact Checking Time?  Sidewalk Ordinance does not equal Anti-Homeless, sorry.  What else you got that would prove Mr. Mah is anti-homeless?  If you have nothing else, I would ask you to look at his body of work which includes the Thurston County Food Bank and United Way (local chapter, not national).  In fact, and I don't recall the details, but he was instrumental in clearing hurdles the food bank was running into a while back.  He's actually an advocate for homeless, just not the way you'd want him to be.
»

A Public Sidewalk..


Is for everyone's use..

Not just the shoppers..

And the 1st Amendment Applies there all the time..

Not just when you feel it should..

Making it illegal for a person downtown to: "orally" "beg, solicit, or plead" in order to receive "alms or charity"  not only targets the homeless, its also unconstitutional..

»

Here ya go, since your

Here ya go, since you're opposed to discovering it on your own:

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=seattle+roulette+9th

Read the decision.  Upheld.  Constitutional.  Unless the SC has reversed, it stands as ruled upon and the city is legally in good standing.

»

Tone it down EH...


Question:

Have you even read Roulette v City Of Seattle?

»

Yes, all of it.  I'll tone

Yes, all of it.  I'll tone it down when you submit fact instead of emotion.
»

Proof?


Im a person walking on a public sidewalk downtown who is about to "orally"; "beg, solicit, or plead" in order to receive "alms or charity"..

Explain to me where Roulette v City Of Seattle applies here..


»

Venetian Casino v. Local Board of Las Vegas

Don't get too carried away with Roulette. 

Venetian can be read here.  That one reaffirmed sidewalks as public space even when they are constructed on private property with private funds.  From page 13 of that 41 page decision:
For "[t]ime out of mind public streets and
sidewalks have been used for public assembly and debate, the
hallmarks of a traditional public forum" Frisby v. Schultz, 487
U.S. 474, 480 (1988) (quotation omitted). They are the
"archetype" of a traditional public forum. Id.

I scanned Frisby and notice that it gives a lot of leeway to use of the public forum for picketing.  Frisby can be read here

Reading Frisby makes me wonder if a picketer choosing to sit or lie down in the course of their picket would have the protection of this Supreme Court decision in this seated or lying down picketing activity.

Roulette is far from "settled law" with regard to the various public uses of sidewalks.
»

things that stand out

Two things immediately stand out to me in the drawing of parallels between the majority decision in Roulette and Olympia's Pedestrian Interference ordinance.

The first is that as a result of the passage of this ordinance anyone sitting on a sidewalk in downtown Olympia could (should) state that his/her sitting is in protest against OMC Section 9.16, thus making her/his presence an exercise of "facial freedom of expression." For example? Holding a sign which reads, "can you spare any change to help me protest OMC Section 9.16?"

The second thing that stands out is that the scope of Olympia's ordinance is far more vast than Seattle's. As per definition 3: "Public place" means an area generally visible to public view and includes alleys, bridges, buildings, driveways, parking lots, parks, plazas, sidewalks, and streets open to the general public including places that serve food or drink or provide entertainment, in the doorways and entrances to buildings or dwellings and the grounds enclosing them. Whereas in his majority decision Judge Kozinski states affirmation of Seattle's ordinance in part on the basis that it "doesn't restrict sitting or lying in public parks, private or public plazas, or alleys, nor sitting on the sidewalk in noncommercial areas of the city." This is a pretty major difference if one seeks legal justification vis a vis parallel reasoning.

Oh yeah, all italic emphasis is mine.

"Anybody who doesn't know that politics is crime has got a few screws loose."

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Because of the picketing

Because of the picketing protection afforded by the US Supreme Court in Frisby if I was planning to test the constitutional waters by sitting in protest of the ordinance, I would have alter your sign suggestion just a bit and have it say: "can you spare any change. I am picketing here to protest OMC Section 9.16?"

All of this conjecture of course, not to be construed as legal advice.  For legal advice on the matter I think I would look to the ACLU for assistance.
»

"All of this conjecture of

"All of this conjecture of course, not to be construed as legal advice. For legal advice on the matter I think I would look to the ACLU for assistance."

Yes, excellent addendum. One of those, "I should've said that!" moments.Contacting the Washington chapter of the ACLU.

"Anybody who doesn't know that politics is crime has got a few screws loose."

»

He has my vote. I think the

He has my vote. I think the sidewalk sitting ordinance was a waste of time, but he's pro-law enforcement, and that's a vote in my book.
»

Wasted Money....


What about all the time and money Doug Mah made us waste on that stupid Conference Center idea?

He ended costing the city almost a million dollars studying it, by the time he was done dragging his feet..

The Sidewalk Ordinance is another waste..

By the time they get through fighting that in court, and hiring extra officers to end up on Youtube, uh.., i mean.., enforce the Ordinance, the City will be out even more millions..

Sad really..

Olympia deserves better...

»

Yeah

I'd sink a million into a stupid conference center that might actually kickstart the city rather than a thousand into the NFZ that doesn't do jack-squat.

Politicians spend money, sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't. I'm going more for intent here. I haven't made up my mind yet but he's looking better to me than others on the council.

»

Norm, make me a promise.

Please promise me that you won't cast a vote based on one issue. Attend the debates and forums, get to know all of his issues. Then vote for him based on who he is, not just one side. Our current president won two elections by appealing to christian voters in the heartland (flyover), he then turned his back on them in many ways, such as cutting farm subsidies. Also, look back at the original ordinances that Mah introduced this summer, and decide whether he's someone that represents your values.

“One man scorned and covered with scars still strove with his last ounce of courage to reach the unreachable stars; and the world was better for this.

»

Ah, the plea.  He's not a

Ah, the plea.  He's not a one issue guy, fortunately.  I predict a win.
»

I'll keep an open mind

we have a little ways to go anyway.
»

Mah will not go unopposed.

That's a guarantee.

“One man scorned and covered with scars still strove with his last ounce of courage to reach the unreachable stars; and the world was better for this.

»

Don't wait until the last

Don't wait until the last minute like Booth did!  You saw what happened there...
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Mah will get my personal support

and I predict many if not most of the police department will support him as well. The Police Guild supported him in the past, and I believe we will support him in the future.

Saying he is anti-homeless is incorrect. And I do believe he brings balance to the current City Council.

"If everyone is thinking alike, someone isn't thinking." General George S. Patton Jr.

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oh

nice quote.

"Anybody who doesn't know that politics is crime has got a few screws loose."

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funny that,

Mah is supported by police and big developers. Usually those endorsements are reserved for republicans.

“One man scorned and covered with scars still strove with his last ounce of courage to reach the unreachable stars; and the world was better for this.

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Police, in the past, were

Police, in the past, were supported by democrats. Democrats have changed over the years, and now seem to be more into helping out the criminal as opposed to the people risking their lives to keep the public safe.
»

Jumper cables.

Jumper cables.
»

Democrats are more interested in helping criminals?

I do not believe that for one minute and I imagine that if you thought about it for a minute you would not believe it either.  Being interested in the fair application of justice is not siding with criminals or being supportive of them.  I am sure there are some crimes that Democrats and liberals don't belive should be prosecuted as such, along the lines of personal use of marijuana, but I can't imagine a single Democrat that doesn't think a person convicted of stealing or murder shouldn't spend time in prison.  Being against the death penalty doesn't mean that you are on the side of criminals, it just means you do not want your government killing people in your name.  The accused do have rights.  The state has all the power.  Those in power need to exercise that power justly and make certain that they always respect the rights of the accused.  I don't think this is pro-criminal, it think this is just pro Constitution.

"I would make it impossible for the covetous and avaricious to utterly impoverish the poor. The rich can take care of themselves."
^@^
»

I don't want to hijack the

I don't want to hijack the thread, so I'll leave it at this: 

I'm going to have to respectfully disagree with you Crenshaw. In my short life, in conversations I've had with folks who identify as liberal, progressive, and when forced to choose, democrat, I've noticed this trend over and over again. When it comes down to a murder, or rape, sure they are into the idea of imprisonment, everything else they want another alternative. God forbid it involves someone they know or love.

As for the death sentence, that wasn't what I was going after. I'm still a bit on the fence with capital punishment.

Our system is setup so that the state has to prove beyond a reasonable doubt. Which is fair, unfortunately if the state screws up with ANY procedure, the bad guy can get off on a technicality. Where the hell is the justice there? This comes to mind.

So yeah, my thoughts. If someone does something wrong, they go to jail/prison. I don't care if jail/prison is a scary place, you should have thought about that before you committed the crime. No sympathy from me, at all.

FYI this applies to marijuana, drinking and driving, and other things that people don't consider to be "that big a deal".

 

»

I encourage you to post your

I encourage you to post your ideas on this as a new blog thread.  I would be interested in hearing you reconcile the number of people that are incarcerated in the US with a justice system that you believe lets a lot of people escape incarceration on "technicalities."  I would be interested in hearing about your support for the taxation required to support the current or an expanded prison industry. 

This thread is about Mah.  I think he is a slick mouthpiece for the money interests, the top 2% of the income spectrum, none of whom post here, the folks who have been winning their class warfare for the past thirty years.  I think he will play to the folks who are manipulated by the money interests by working on low impact public policy that plays to the prejudices of the manipulated folks, but he serves the top 2%.  Where the public policy has impact and where the money interests care, he will serve their wishes.  Best government that money can buy.
»

Your link runs to a NWCN

Your link runs to a NWCN article of a few hundred words that compresses the Appeals Court decision down to "accepting a donut" as a technicality that allows a person a second trial. 

but here is the text of the Court of Appeals decision about the Judge's inappropriate ex parte communications with the jurors in the case and how, in totality, the ex parte communications between the judge and jurors cause the Ct  of Appeals to remand for new trial and new judge:

Readability is so-so, here's a link if anyone wants to read carefully. 
We now turn to the
merits of DeGroff's claim that the trial court's ex parte juror contacts
cumulatively undermined the integrity of his trial and require reversal of
his conviction. We agree that they did.
Ex Parte Communications
A trial court should not communicate with the jury in the absence of
the defendant. State v. Bourgeois, 133 Wn.2d 389, 407, 945 P.2d 1120
(1997); State v. Caliguri, 99 Wn.2d 501, 508, 664 P.2d 466 (1983). The
appropriate practice for a trial judge is to communicate with a jury only
with all parties present. State v. Langdon, 42 Wn. App. 715, 717, 713 P.2d
120, review denied, 105 Wn.2d 1013 (1986). Communications between the
court and the jury in the absence of the defendant violate the defendant's
constitutional right to be present at all stages of the proceedings against
him. State v. Bourgeois, 82 Wn. App. 314, 324, 917 P.2d 1101 (1996),
rev'd, 133 Wn.2d 389 (1997). As our Supreme Court aptly put it more than a
century ago:
In the discharge of his official duty the place for the judge is on the
bench. As to him the law has closed the portals of the jury room and he
may not enter. The {defendant} was not obliged to follow the judge to the
jury room in order to protect his legal rights, or to see that the jury was
not influenced by the presence of the judge; and the state cannot be
permitted to show what occurred between the judge and the jury at a place
where the judge had no right to be, and in regard to which no official
record could be made.

State v. Wroth, 15 Wash. 621, 623, 47 P. 106 (1896); see also United States
v. Smith, 31 F.3d 469, 471 (7th Cir. 1994) ('{T}he unusual practice of a
judge entering the jury room to speak
privately with jurors is almost certain to run afoul of a defendant's right
to be present during trial proceedings.').
In this case, we are troubled by each of the trial judge's ex parte
contacts. We find particularly disconcerting the judge's advice to a juror
regarding the giving of a victim impact statement in a separate criminal
case and the judge's failure to disclose to the parties a juror's knowledge
of an individual in a video DeGroff had presented as part of his defense.
DeGroff maintains that such contacts require automatic reversal. While we
disagree that reversal is automatic, the record here demonstrates that
reversal is required.
Our Supreme Court has held that where ex parte contacts occur in the
presence of a third party, those contacts are to be reviewed under a
constitutional harmless error analysis. Caliguri, 99 Wn.2d at 509. The
court in that case did not address whether the same test also applied to
private contacts between a judge and juror:
To the extent . . . cases turn on the privacy of the communication between
judge and jury, we reserve judgment. Where the only persons with knowledge
of what took place are the judge who erred and the jurors affected by the
error, the argument for a conclusive presumption of error has more force.

Caliguri, 99 Wn.2d at 509. But the United States Supreme Court has
concluded that harmless error analysis applies even to private ex parte
communications:
There is scarcely a lengthy trial in which one or more jurors do not have
occasion to speak to the trial judge about something, whether it relates to
a matter of personal comfort or to some aspect of the trial. The . . .
conclusion that an unrecorded ex parte communication between trial judge
and juror can never be harmless error ignores these day-to-day realities of
courtroom life and undermines society's interest in the administration of
criminal justice.

Rushen v. Spain, 464 U.S. 114, 117-18, 104 S. Ct. 453, 78 L. Ed. 2d 267
(1983). Such a conclusion was also suggested in Bourgeois, 133 Wn.2d at
407-08, where the court held that
private ex parte contacts between the judge, bailiff, and jury were
harmless because no affirmative information was communicated. See also In
re Personal Restraint of Benn, 134 Wn.2d 868, 921, 952 P.2d 116 (1998)
(violation of the right to be present at all critical stages of a criminal
proceeding is subject to constitutional harmless error analysis); State v.
Johnson, 125 Wn. App. 443, 460-61, 105 P.3d 85 (2005) (applying
constitutional harmless error test to private contacts between the jury and
bailiff).
In light of Rushen and Bourgeois, we apply a constitutional harmless
error test to the ex parte jury contacts in this case. Under this test,
the defendant must first raise at least the possibility of prejudice before
the State bears the burden to show that the communications complained of
did not contribute to the verdict obtained. Bourgeois, 133 Wn.2d at 407;
Caliguri, 99 Wn.2d at 509. Ordinarily, no prejudice results from neutral
communications that convey no information. Langdon, 42 Wn. App. at 717-18
(court's written response to jury question about an instruction simply
referred the jury back to the previous instruction). But once the
potential for prejudice is shown, the State bears the burden of showing
that the error was harmless beyond a reasonable doubt. Bourgeois, 133
Wn.2d at 407. This is an extremely high burden for the State to meet, for
even '{t}he appearance of bias or prejudice can be as damaging to public
confidence in the administration of justice as would be the actual presence
of bias or prejudice.' State v. Dugan, 96 Wn. App. 346, 354, 979 P.2d 885
(1999) (quoting State v. Madry, 8 Wn. App. 61, 70, 504 P.2d 1156 (1972)).
And even if we are able to conclude that multiple errors are each harmless,
such errors will require a new trial if the cumulative effect of the errors
seriously impugned the defendant's right to a fair trial. State v. Greiff,
141 Wn.2d 910, 929, 10 P.3d 390 (2000).
Although the doughnut and potluck contacts involved neutral
communications, therefore rendering the incidents harmless in isolation,6
the record suggests that they opened a communication line between the jury
and the trial judge. This is reflected in the trial judge's decision to
meet privately with a juror to discuss that juror's involvement in an
unrelated criminal matter. The potential prejudice in such a situation is
readily apparent:
Any ex parte meeting or communication between the judge and {a juror} . . .
is pregnant with possibilities for error. . . . {E}ven an experienced trial
judge cannot be certain to avoid all the pitfalls inherent in such an
enterprise. First, it is difficult to contain, much less to anticipate,
the direction the conversation will take at such a meeting. Unexpected
questions or comments can generate unintended and misleading impressions of
the judge's subjective personal views which have no place in his
instruction to the jury all the more so when counsel are not present to
challenge the statements.

United States v. U.S. Gypsum Co., 438 U.S. 422, 460, 98 S. Ct. 2864, 57 L.
Ed. 2d 854 (1978). The judge's discussion with the juror about victim
impact statements and the weight that he affords them, permitted the juror
to infer, however unintended it may have been, the judge's own views on
victim testimony. The juror's perception of the judge's opinion of victim
impact statements may have influenced that juror's weighing of the
testimony presented at DeGroff's trial.
We acknowledge that the juror with whom the judge conferred was
excused at DeGroff's request when the juror arrived to court on Monday.
The improper meeting occurred in the afternoon on the preceding Thursday
and there was no trial on Friday. But while it appears
likely that the juror did not discuss her meeting with the judge with any
of the sitting jurors, we cannot say from this record that she did not do
so.
As to the undisclosed, undisputed ex parte written communication
between the trial judge and another juror, this too was improper. One of
the jurors told the judge that he knew an individual present at the party
where K.W. alleged that DeGroff had inappropriately touched her. Because
this information was never brought to the attention of the parties, there
was no opportunity to pursue the nature of the juror's relationship to the
individual, the individual's interest in the trial, and whether the juror
could remain impartial. These issues bore directly on whether the juror
should be replaced with an alternate. Again, we recognize that the jury
ultimately found DeGroff not guilty of molesting K.W. and that the judge
instructed the juror that his knowledge of the individual was not relevant.
But once more, this contact reflects what appears to have been an improper
contacts policy between the judge and jury.
Although some of the four juror contacts might be harmless in
isolation, we are left with serious doubts about the integrity of DeGroff's
trial. The contacts here were not isolated and repeated juror contacts
required DeGroff 'to follow the judge to the jury room in order to protect
his legal rights, or to see that the jury was not influenced by the
presence of the judge.' Wroth, 15 Wash. at 623. The constitution requires
an ironclad wall between judge and jury. And while we offer no opinion as
to validity of the comments underlying DeGroff's counsel's bias
allegations, we cannot ignore such allegations when we consider the other
undisputed events that occurred in this case. The undisputed ex parte
contacts that occurred in this case undermined the integrity and
reliability of the trial to such an extent that we are unable to say beyond
a reasonable doubt that DeGroff was not prejudiced by them.
We reverse DeGroff's convictions and remand for a new trial.
Additionally, although we do not express an opinion regarding the trial
judge's alleged bias, for the sole purpose of avoiding any appearance of
unfairness, we instruct the Thurston County Superior Court to assign this
case for trial before a different judge.
A majority of the panel having determined that this opinion will not
be printed in the Washington Appellate Reports, but will be filed for
public record pursuant to RCW 2.06.040, it is so ordered.

QUINN-BRINTNALL, C.J.
I have found that when I hear about how a stupid technicality has caused a "criminal to go free", if I take the time to study the Court's opinion, I find that the stupid technicality has most often occurred at the level of the journalist, not at the level of the Court.
»

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