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Submitted by The Original Yoda on Tue, 08/05/2008 - 11:21pm.
No one wears masks or hoods or black. The police are welcomed and families feel safe and welcome. People chant about building things rather than tearing them down. Protestors are always courteous to their neighbors. Participants sing appropriate songs but don't yell or scream. Everybody smiles. Members self police and guide those who are straying from the rules. No one destroys property or harms others. Someone hires a PIO to put a good face on the protest. (Peace needs good PR) Those that choose civil disobedience should peacefully allow themselves to be arrested and removed. The police should arrest those who practice civil disobedience instead of escalating things with pepper spray etc. ...you may say I'm a dreamer but I'm not the only one.
Anyone else care to imagine?
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Yoda...
Submitted by Keith Hufnagel on Wed, 08/06/2008 - 12:41am.Yes
Submitted by Sarah on Wed, 08/06/2008 - 7:58am.In my imaginary protest there is room for most everyone and everything. Because this protest winds like streams to a river to an ocean.........wherever needed.
Some of us walk silent with a lone voice lifted high in a funeral dirge, some of us walk proud and quick with all manner of noise. All ages, on foot and on wheel.
Food, shelter, and care is available along the way. Because this is a long trip we are on.
Care to imagine?
Submitted by chad360 on Wed, 08/06/2008 - 10:18am.Very excellent post...made my day (just returned from some quiet time in nature).
I doubt I could imagine a better scene than the one you described, so thanks for putting such good thoughts into my head =)
A different Imagination
Submitted by DrewHendricks on Wed, 08/06/2008 - 10:33am.No one is afraid of people who wear masks or hoods or black.
The police are disarmed and thus families feel safe and welcome.
People chant about building things rather than tearing them down.
Protesters are always courteous to their neighbors because we all protest something at some point, and we're all neighbors.
Participants sing appropriate songs but don't yell or scream.
Everybody smiles.
Participants practice self restraint and guide those who are straying from the rules which are arrived at through discussion.
No one destroys property or harms others.
People disregard paid representation and represent themselves.
Those that choose civil disobedience also practice enough stealth to get away with it without being caught.
The police no longer exist.
...you may say I'm a dreamer because I am. The reality of protest and especially resistance in the United States is that it suffers actual repression, predicated not on the supposed actions of the victims but on the need of the police to raise the cost of the protest / resistance until it disappears or turns violent. Why do they want it to turn violent? Because they know how to deal with that. It's self-discrediting, as long as it's "our" violence and not police violence. In all, I find the tendency to blame "the protesters" for violence or for confrontation to be seriously naive. Just stop and think for a moment: who trains more for using force? Police or peace activists?
Yoda interesting post, and I was kind of diggin' some of it,
Submitted by JT on Wed, 08/06/2008 - 11:24am.until you had to put the picture of the Patron Saint of secular socialism, and made reference to his song Imagine.
If you are bored with Olyblog, come have some fun at the cool forum spot in Olympia, "olyforums.org/forum"
itchyhitch.blogspot.com
I asked Yoda to change it to this for you
Submitted by Guglielmo on Wed, 08/06/2008 - 11:40am."We'll put a boot up your ass, it's the American way..."
Don't worry JT...
Submitted by The Original Yoda on Wed, 08/06/2008 - 3:09pm.LOL,
Submitted by JT on Wed, 08/06/2008 - 3:55pm.yeah Yoda, the door was open for you to jump through on that one....touche!
If you are bored with Olyblog, come have some fun at the cool forum spot in Olympia, "olyforums.org/forum"
itchyhitch.blogspot.com
Sad
Submitted by Robert Whitlock on Wed, 08/06/2008 - 6:03pm.You know better than to turn this
Submitted by Guglielmo on Wed, 08/06/2008 - 6:08pm.I didn't do it!
Submitted by Robert Whitlock on Wed, 08/06/2008 - 6:21pm.LOL,
Submitted by JT on Wed, 08/06/2008 - 12:39pm.thanks Gug.
If you are bored with Olyblog, come have some fun at the cool forum spot in Olympia, "olyforums.org/forum"
itchyhitch.blogspot.com
Anytime
Submitted by Guglielmo on Wed, 08/06/2008 - 12:48pm.thanks Yoda , I agree.
Submitted by srh31 on Wed, 08/06/2008 - 1:59pm.MLK wasn't the be-all end-all of NV resistance
Submitted by DrewHendricks on Fri, 08/08/2008 - 5:36pm.stealth and other matters
Submitted by Tenzing on Wed, 08/06/2008 - 7:26pm.???
Submitted by Guglielmo on Wed, 08/06/2008 - 7:26pm.Sure, there are posers, people who say they are against the war but spend most of their time criticising PMR and their associates. But many people who regret the actions of PMR are deeply committed to peace and non-violence and express those opinions publicly. I don't question their commitment.
Just expressing an anti-war
Submitted by Bethel on Wed, 08/06/2008 - 11:56pm.Sad and true...
Submitted by The Original Yoda on Thu, 08/07/2008 - 12:24am....however, nothing has ended "the war" yet.
The public perception of this conflict is different than say Vietnam, where one could make a case that protesting "did something".
A couple big things that are different now:
1. We do not see dead people on TV every night. Press coverage of the conflict and it's victims is heavily controlled.
2. No draft.
Many differences
Submitted by DrewHendricks on Fri, 08/08/2008 - 5:45pm.The occupation of Iraq, by contrast, is to keep Iraq from feeding China. Oil. (not rice). Big difference, it is true.
They always blame the messenger
Submitted by the original ep on Wed, 08/06/2008 - 11:38pm.Nice post Yoda
Submitted by Laurian on Thu, 08/07/2008 - 9:44am.Paranoid post Drew.
JT, what's wrong with secular humanism? Perhaps we should take our back and forth to another forum.
sounds like yoda wants a parade, not a protest.
Submitted by DSnyder on Thu, 08/07/2008 - 11:09am.Actually...
Submitted by The Original Yoda on Thu, 08/07/2008 - 11:20am....I'm trying to challenge the current notion of "this is what a protest looks like".
I'd like to see an anti-war movement that is conscious of the media and the message which it sends.
I would submit that a parade of 1000 peaceful people happily demonstrating for peace is more effective at changing hearts and minds than 300 people shouting "tear it down" and challenging the police.
I understand that folks are angry. I'm just saying "what if this happend?"...
I've posted similar sentiments in the past here.
sounds more like having our hands tied
Submitted by DSnyder on Fri, 08/08/2008 - 2:40pm.by media than actually following the most effective form of resistance.
but hey, have a 60s throwback event. john lennon sure changed the world, let me tell you.
Hey...
Submitted by The Original Yoda on Fri, 08/08/2008 - 2:56pm.Let us not forget the anti-nazi clowns
Submitted by Norm on Thu, 08/07/2008 - 11:47am.Clowns in protest...
Submitted by The Original Yoda on Fri, 08/08/2008 - 4:07pm.Reminds me of Kesey and the pranksters. Kesey said a successful prank must not physically hurt anyone, and the person being pranked must in some way be enlightened by the experience.
Dunno about the enlightenment (unless you count humor which is "enlightening")but that is the exact spirit I'd like to see being used in the peace movement!
My Imaginary Protest
Submitted by Robert Whitlock on Thu, 08/07/2008 - 4:04pm.Most important, the protest would be less of a protest than a social gathering. It would be above all and most importantly - totally inclusive. Everyone and anyone (who doesn't intend to do harm, to hurt, or to damage the purpose of the gathering) ought to feel welcome and comfortable in their participation.
The "protest" would be fun, it should be provocative and engaging. It would inspire action and thought, communication and diverse dialogue. It would challenge any pre-conceived notions, both of the participants and the "on-lookers."
The "protest" gathering would seek to reconcile differences and to promote healing, understanding and peace.
The protest would be nonviolent - in the Satyagraha sense of the word (i.e. not the simple absence of violence). The gathering would be in the service of life - all life (mosquitoes and hornets possibly excepted).
Participants would be held to the principles of truth, of The Golden Rule (that is to treat others as you wish to be treated, without exception.)
There is maybe more, maybe a lot more. But I wanted to add to this discussion before I ran out of momentum for it.
peace, bert
Thanks for your input, Rob.
Submitted by The Original Yoda on Thu, 08/07/2008 - 4:08pm.More
Submitted by Robert Whitlock on Thu, 08/07/2008 - 4:14pm.For example, I think the PMR blockades can be totally nonviolent. I think they can be truly uplifting and effective. They can be constructive and creative. It all depends on the vision and the desire of the participants.
Yes there is a lot of this society that is worthy of tearing down. But rather than focus on and project the negative, I would prefer to dwell in a positive vision of what is to come. I would prefer to focus on love, kinship (between human beings and the planet and everything else), open-mindedness, tolerance, inclusiveness, welcomingness, and just plain old being nice.
That is a very good
Submitted by luvdwntwn on Fri, 08/08/2008 - 10:00am.