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Submitted by The Original Yoda on Tue, 08/05/2008 - 11:21pm.

No one wears masks or hoods or black.

The police are welcomed and families feel safe and welcome.

People chant about building things rather than tearing them down.

Protestors are always courteous to their neighbors.

Participants sing appropriate songs but don't yell or scream.

Everybody smiles.

Members self police and guide those who are straying from the rules.

No one destroys property or harms others.

Someone hires a PIO to put a good face on the protest. (Peace needs good PR)

Those that choose civil disobedience should peacefully allow themselves to be arrested and removed.

The police should arrest those who practice civil disobedience instead of escalating things with pepper spray etc.

...you may say I'm a dreamer but I'm not the only one.

 

 

 

Anyone else care to imagine? 

»

Yoda...

No. While the specific tactics of some protests may not be ripe for the current circumstances, that does not imply that the tactics are not ripe for the objective in general. But, you bring up a very good point. We cannot do anything divided. We certainly must learn how to get along with our foes in order to facilitate change and erase the gaps. Lets do that now. The only way that will make a change is to stop purchasing oil. Everything else is icing on a lead cake.
»

Yes

In my imaginary protest there is room for most everyone and everything. Because this protest winds like streams to a river to an ocean.........wherever needed.

Some of us walk silent with a lone voice lifted high in a funeral dirge, some of us walk proud and quick with all manner of noise. All ages, on foot and on wheel.

Food, shelter, and care is available along the way. Because this is a long trip we are on.

»

Care to imagine?

Very excellent post...made my day (just returned from some quiet time in nature).

I doubt I could imagine a better scene than the one you described, so thanks for putting such good thoughts into my head =)

chad360

»

A different Imagination

In my imaginary uprising,

No one is afraid of people who wear masks or hoods or black.

The police are disarmed and thus families feel safe and welcome.

People chant about building things rather than tearing them down.

Protesters are always courteous to their neighbors because we all protest something at some point, and we're all neighbors.

Participants sing appropriate songs but don't yell or scream.

Everybody smiles.

Participants practice self restraint and guide those who are straying from the rules which are arrived at through discussion.

No one destroys property or harms others.

People disregard paid representation and represent themselves.

Those that choose civil disobedience also practice enough stealth to get away with it without being caught.

The police no longer exist.

...you may say I'm a dreamer because I am. The reality of protest and especially resistance in the United States is that it suffers actual repression, predicated not on the supposed actions of the victims but on the need of the police to raise the cost of the protest / resistance until it disappears or turns violent. Why do they want it to turn violent? Because they know how to deal with that. It's self-discrediting, as long as it's "our" violence and not police violence. In all, I find the tendency to blame "the protesters" for violence or for confrontation to be seriously naive. Just stop and think for a moment: who trains more for using force? Police or peace activists?

»

Yoda interesting post, and I was kind of diggin' some of it,

until you had to put the picture of the Patron Saint of secular socialism, and made reference to his song Imagine.

If you are bored with Olyblog, come have some fun at the cool forum spot in Olympia, "olyforums.org/forum"

itchyhitch.blogspot.com

»

I asked Yoda to change it to this for you

"We'll put a boot up your ass, it's the American way..."

»

Don't worry JT...

...John Lennon won't be writing any new songs or stirring up any new trouble. A crazy guy with a pistol took care of that. :)
»

LOL,

yeah Yoda, the door was open for you to jump through on that one....touche!

If you are bored with Olyblog, come have some fun at the cool forum spot in Olympia, "olyforums.org/forum"

itchyhitch.blogspot.com

»

Sad

It's so sad to think of all the innocent people who have been killed and wounded by guns.




»

You know better than to turn this

a gun thread, Mr.
»

I didn't do it!

Of course, you're completely right.




»

LOL,

thanks Gug.

If you are bored with Olyblog, come have some fun at the cool forum spot in Olympia, "olyforums.org/forum"

itchyhitch.blogspot.com

»

Anytime

It was either Toby or Nugent, but the flag picture settled it for me.
»

thanks Yoda , I agree.

Drew- MLK Jr didn't do what he did with stealth. If he did, we wouldn't have the Letter from Birmingham Jail and the Civil Rights Movement probably wouldn't have been what it was if he had.
»

MLK wasn't the be-all end-all of NV resistance

MLK was a deeply flawed man with a deeply profound vision of change, and how to achieve it - but he isn't the touchstone of all resistance in this country. We would not have any of the gains of labor in the 18th, 19th, 20th centuries if it were not for passive sabotage and obstruction at the point of production. Many Polish Jews would not be alive if it were not for active resistance, sabotage, and criminal activity carried out by subject peoples under occupation by the Germans. Examples in history of the use of unattributed resistance are too many to cover here, but believe me they are important in any struggle, especially this one. Come on, they're handing out 20-year sentences for arson, if it's political. That can't have missed your gaze, can it?
»

stealth and other matters

Martin Luther King, Jr., may not have practiced "stealth"--and I believe in transparency myself, as well as nonviolence--but others instrumental to the success of the civil rights movement were open to other positions.

One was Malcolm X, who said in the last year of his life:

"We declare our right on this earth to be a man, to be a human being, to be respected as a human being, to be given the rights of a human being in this society, on this earth, in this day, which we intend to bring into existence by any means necessary."

Proponents of direct action such as the Port Militarization Resistance movement are, I think, too often and unfairly criticized for militancy, oftentimes by people claiming to be opponents of war and occupation themselves. Rarely do these critics condemn the violence and other illegal actions of the "law enforcement" agencies; and I suspect that they do little if anything to try to halt the violence perpetrated by their own government in Iraq and Afghanistan.


»

???

"Rarely do these critics condemn the violence and other illegal actions of the "law enforcement" agencies; and I suspect that they do little if anything to try to halt the violence perpetrated by their own government in Iraq and Afghanistan."

Sure, there are posers, people who say they are against the war but spend most of their time criticising PMR and their associates.  But many people who regret the actions of PMR are deeply committed to peace and non-violence and express those opinions publicly.  I don't question their commitment.

»

Just expressing an anti-war

Just expressing an anti-war opinion without some kind of solid and committed action hasn't ended the war yet...
»

Sad and true...

...however, nothing has ended "the war" yet.

The public perception of this conflict is different than say Vietnam, where one could make a case that protesting "did something".

A couple big things that are different now: 

1. We do not see dead people on TV every night. Press coverage of the conflict and it's victims is heavily controlled.

2. No draft.

 

»

Many differences

VietNam was to China what Nebraska is to the United States. The US obtained its war aims in VietNam, which became industrialized, no longer fed China, and produces sweatshop labor conditions and thus profits in international money markets. These can be financially manipulated to pull value from any economic subunit in the empire to anywhere else, primarily from London or New York (though transnational capitalism is just that - transnational). So the war in VietNam was not "lost" by the U.S., it was lost by the people of VietNam and the Soldiers of the US Army, Air Force, Navy, and Marines.

The occupation of Iraq, by contrast, is to keep Iraq from feeding China. Oil. (not rice). Big difference, it is true.

»

They always blame the messenger

Love you Yoda. Truer words I have not heard of late. If capitalists would realize that they have a responsibility to the societies they require to sustain themselves upon, and gave a fair share back, we secular (democratic)socialists could just stick to singing good songs to live, work eat and live by.
»

Nice post Yoda

Paranoid post Drew.

JT, what's wrong with secular humanism? Perhaps we should take our back and forth to another forum. 

»

sounds like yoda wants a parade, not a protest.

which is great if having fun is more important to you than challenging something.
»

Actually...

...I'm trying to challenge the current notion of "this is what a protest looks like".

I'd like to see an anti-war movement that is conscious of the media and the message which it sends.

I would submit that a parade of 1000 peaceful people happily demonstrating for peace is more effective at changing hearts and minds than 300 people shouting "tear it down" and challenging the police.

I understand that folks are angry. I'm just saying "what if this happend?"...

I've posted similar sentiments in the past here.

»

sounds more like having our hands tied

by media than actually following the most effective form of resistance.

but hey, have a 60s throwback event. john lennon sure changed the world, let me tell you.

»

Hey...

...I guess it depends on what your goals are. You can try to use the media effectively or you can ignore the media and let them tell the public what to think about the peace movement. The power is in your own hands. What form of world changing resistance would you advocate instead?
»

Let us not forget the anti-nazi clowns

which, in my opinion, was a very effective protest, and very easy to get behind and support.
»

Clowns in protest...

...sounds like an awesome idea to me. Thanks Norm.

Reminds me of Kesey and the pranksters. Kesey said a successful prank must not physically hurt anyone, and the person being pranked must in some way be enlightened by the experience.

Dunno about the enlightenment (unless you count humor which is "enlightening")but that is the exact spirit I'd like to see being used in the peace movement!
»

My Imaginary Protest

My imaginary protest has a lot of similar ideas as some of those posted above.

Most important, the protest would be less of a protest than a social gathering. It would be above all and most importantly - totally inclusive. Everyone and anyone (who doesn't intend to do harm, to hurt, or to damage the purpose of the gathering) ought to feel welcome and comfortable in their participation.

The "protest" would be fun, it should be provocative and engaging. It would inspire action and thought, communication and diverse dialogue. It would challenge any pre-conceived notions, both of the participants and the "on-lookers."

The "protest" gathering would seek to reconcile differences and to promote healing, understanding and peace.

The protest would be nonviolent - in the Satyagraha sense of the word (i.e. not the simple absence of violence). The gathering would be in the service of life - all life (mosquitoes and hornets possibly excepted).

Participants would be held to the principles of truth, of The Golden Rule (that is to treat others as you wish to be treated, without exception.)

There is maybe more, maybe a lot more. But I wanted to add to this discussion before I ran out of momentum for it.

peace, bert




»

Thanks for your input, Rob.

PEACE!
»

More

The energy would be constructive and creative - and definitely would not preclude direct action, civil resistance and/or civil disobedience.

For example, I think the PMR blockades can be totally nonviolent. I think they can be truly uplifting and effective. They can be constructive and creative. It all depends on the vision and the desire of the participants.

Yes there is a lot of this society that is worthy of tearing down. But rather than focus on and project the negative, I would prefer to dwell in a positive vision of what is to come. I would prefer to focus on love, kinship (between human beings and the planet and everything else), open-mindedness, tolerance, inclusiveness, welcomingness, and just plain old being nice.




»

That is a very good

That is a very good comment.... What a great protest that would be with no violence and destruction! That would be fantastic!
»

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