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Submitted by security_six on Thu, 02/14/2008 - 10:26pm.

Recently a thread was started which relied upon the work of discredited author Michael Bellesiles to make a point. 

For the sake of proper scholarship here is some information about the wonderful bit of work Bellesiles did...

From Reason Magazine "Bellesiles had flung his challenge at a political organization, but unfortunately for him it was the scholarly community that picked it up. The evidence he had presented for his groundbreaking theory was investigated first by experts from a range of disciplines and political viewpoints; then by a special symposium in a learned journal; and finally, as a result of the disturbing findings, by the professor's university and an outside panel of scholars that it appointed. The results are now in: Bellesiles' arguments are based on wholesale misuse of evidence and, in some cases, no evidence at all. The "invented tradition" is fact, the professor's version a folk tale."

The History News Network had a bit to say too... 

Of course a criticism of Bellesiles would not be complete without his resignation from Emory University 

 CFIF.org  "Shortly before last Christmas, Columbia University finally took back the Bancroft Prize, concluding, some time after the rest of the world, that Bellesiles had "violated basic norms of scholarship."  Now, Alfred A. Knopf, the book's publisher, has pulled the plug on publication."

The New York Times reports on the revocation of the Bancroft Prize 

 

Without going into the subject matter of the book, I find it an affront to any sort of meaningful exchange that so widely discredited a work as this one is being referenced as a serious work.   

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Great Job!

Excellent work!!!!

Thanks

Jeff Brigham


"America’s greatest chapter is still to be written, for the best is yet to come."
President Ronald Reagan
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Given this, I would ask Guglielmo to defend his post.

image
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Six

My original post did not rely on Bellesiles's book. I described the book as "flawed" and "descredited" and I repeated none of its findings. I brought up the book because of the methods Bellesiles used in his unsuccessful attempt to re-examine the facts regarding gun ownership in colonial America. I rewrote the last paragraph of that post to remove any possible amiguity about Bellesiles's book. I also removed the link to his article, which was based on the flawed book and therefore does not belong here. Thanks.  Read more closely.

Practical men, who believe themselves to be quite exempt from any intellectual influence, are usually the slaves of some defunct economist.! --John Maynard Keynes
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Then can I

Bring up phrenology next time I talk about mental health?

You lost me just referencing that piece of crap.  

Yes I read what you wrote, and it seems to me that you must have been desperate to even bring up Bellesiles work.

He was unnsuccessful and had to resort to flawed and improper scholarship to make his point.  Should prove something right there.  

Whereas there is a wealth of literature, essays and evidence supporting my stance.  I gave you a link to start with.

Honestly Jim I'm tired.  I've been saying the same stuff over and over again here.  I have provided many links all over the place to information, scholarship, etc...

I'm just plain tired.

Read guncite.  Follow the trails that it leads you down.  Then let's have this discussion.

Study english common law and early bills of rights regarding bearing arms and personal defense.

Study what the intent of the Founders were in this country.  Read some of the amicus briefs supporting Heller.  Then let's talk. 

The story so far: In the beginning, the Universe was created. This has made a lot of people mad and been widely regarded as a bad idea. -The Restaurant at the end of the Universe

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Six

Once again, no where did I referrence any findings by Bellesiles. And the 99% of the citations you provided me are about gun rights....which I no longer talk about here. So I bid this thread good bye. See you on the "history" thread if you wish to continue in that vien.

Practical men, who believe themselves to be quite exempt from any intellectual influence, are usually the slaves of some defunct economist.! --John Maynard Keynes
»

Rights and ownership

Are intertwined.  You cannot have one without the other, at least in this case.   

 

The story so far: In the beginning, the Universe was created. This has made a lot of people mad and been widely regarded as a bad idea. -The Restaurant at the end of the Universe

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