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Submitted by Rick on Sat, 08/18/2007 - 7:23am.
What's shakin' this weekend? BTW: someone mentioned having the option to post pictures on user profiles, so I've turned that back on. Also, check out stevenl's latest UML research here.
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Minutemen (Nazis) in Seattle
Submitted by Rob Richards on Sat, 08/18/2007 - 9:28am.relish the language abuse...
Submitted by enpen on Sat, 08/18/2007 - 10:37am.Don't you love how the historic example of the minutemen as militia meant to protect a town at a minute's notice from the totalitarian dictatorship that is a monarchy has been corrupted to be a group of armed strongmen volunteering to capture and/or shoot the poor and desperate to escape destitution? Somebody should tell them to get a job.
With you all in spirit
Submitted by Sarah on Sat, 08/18/2007 - 1:42pm.I can't join in this time but hope you are able to tell us about it afterwards.
For anyone who doesn't know, March of the Minutemen is a good series to read.
After a little research,
Submitted by vincent_vega on Sat, 08/18/2007 - 9:23pm.I came up with very little about the Minutemen besides their website and of course, Wikipedia. Now I am not one to support militant groups on either side, but if you are going to level the "Nazi" label on a group, as is done so much these days by usually radical left wing groups, please back up your claims with proof. It gets tiring to see people or groups labelled as Nazis just because someone doesn't like their beliefs.
Here is what I found...
WA State Civil Rights Exec Commissioner Slanders
From: Washington Minuteman Detachment?Minuteman Civil Defense Corps?P.O. Box 3290?Ferndale, WA. 98248-9998?August 2, 2007
To: Washington State Human Rights Commission Marc Brenman, Director?Idolina Reta , Deputy Director?Kathy Baros Friedt, Chair?Ellis Casson?Deborah Sioux Cano-Lee?Jerry Hebert?Shawn Murinko 711 S. Capitol Way, #402?P.O. Box 42490?Olympia, WA 98504-2490
Commissioners,
This letter of protest is written on behalf of the one hundred and ninety-six current members of the Washington State Chapter of the Minuteman Civil Defense Corps. We are addressing this letter of protest to all of the Commissioners on the Washington State Human Rights Commission, as well as to Governor Christine Gregoire, because we are not confident that writing directly to the Commission’s Executive Director, Marc Brenman alone will be either acknowledged or responded to, even though we are all American citizens and residents of Washington State and help pay the taxes which provides for his income.
On Sunday July 15th 2007, the Everett HeraldNet online news publication published a viciously insulting and derogatory opinion piece written by Marc Brenman
http://dhweb.sv.publicus.com/article/20070715OPINION03/707150319&SearchID=73288079879163
in which he maligned all members of “The Minutemen” with the following paragraph:
“The Minutemen rely on the use of hateful speech, the Big Lie, and fear of people who are different to corrupt and coarsen political dialogue, just as their Nazi forebears did. The so-called Minutemen, like their former fellow traveler Tim McVey, are precursors to domestic terrorism and vigilantism.”
In a single paragraph, given without any qualification or example to buttress his accusations, he branded us all as liars, as spreaders of hate and fear, linked us all directly to genocidal Nazism, directly associated us with a mass-murdering domestic terrorist, and said flatly that we are the precursors to terrorism and vigilantism.
Although the piece was published as opinion, Mr. Brenman was identified at the bottom of the article as the “Executive Director of the Washington State Human Rights Commission” which added the implication of “fact” to his opinion as that offered by an officer of the State of Washington. Indeed, why would an officer of the State of Washington, speaking with far-reaching impact, lie to readers by saying things which are not true and cannot be factually substantiated on a point by point basis?
Why would Mr. Brenman openly fabricate such slanderous allegations about people he does not know and could not name and would not recognize in person?
People reading Mr. Brenman’s words could easily believe that he was speaking factually about “Minutemen” organizations in Washington State, rather than simply being vindictively insulting and facetious as he painted all “Minutemen” with the same brush. Indeed, officers of the State are expected to be honest when communicating with the public and at least marginally fair and unbiased when commenting on controversial issues of broad community concern.
But Mr. Brenman was neither honest nor impartial, and he was not fair, and that is why we are so deeply offended by his statements.
It is Mr. Brenman who is relying on the use of hateful speech, the Big Lie, and fear of people who are different to corrupt and coarsen political dialogue.
Mr. Brenman, every member of the Washington State Chapter of the Minuteman Civil Defense Corps is a good, decent, law abiding citizen of both the United States and Washington State. Our ranks include highly decorated veterans of the United States military, police officers, Democrats and Republicans, working class and professionals, Christians and Jews, and people of many races. We do not discriminate on the basis of race or religion or sexual orientation or country of origin.
In fact when a candidate applies to join the Minuteman Civil Defense Corps, a national organization headquartered in Arizona, they are required to undergo legal background checks. Once their background is cleared of any criminal activity, they must then take a pledge to uphold the Constitution of the United States. This pledge includes the line:
“There is no tolerance among Minutemen for racism or bigotry - E Pluribus Unum - Out of Many, One.”
And they must promise to abide by our standard operating procedures, rule number one of which specifies:
“1. Minutemen are courteous to everyone with whom they come into contact, and never discriminate against anyone for any reason.”
Furthermore, our rules clearly and aggressively forbid any hint of vigilantism:
“6. Minutemen follow all federal, state and local laws, understanding that we are being held to a higher standard by all.”
We do not, therefore, understand on what grounds Mr. Brenman could possibly link our membership to Nazis and the mindset of genocide. The Nazis gassed and shot and starved millions of people to death! To compare a group of law abiding American citizens actively advocating for the enforcement of our laws against illegal immigration–to Nazis, is not only patently ridiculous and belittling of the atrocities committed by the Nazis, it is also outrageously false and slanderous to the men and women of the Washington State Chapter of the Minuteman Civil Defense Corps! There is simply no logical comparison between us and the Nazis!
NONE!
We do not, therefore, understand on what grounds Mr. Brenman claims to link us to a domestic terrorist like Timothy McVeigh who killed 186 innocent people at the Alfred P. Murrah federal building in Oklahoma, including wiping out an entire day care center filled with children!
We defend our Constitution, Mr. Brenman, and the likes of Timothy McVeigh would be instantly driven from our ranks!
We do not, therefore, understand why or how Mr. Brenman could possibly state that we are “precursors to domestic terrorism and vigilantism”! We in the Minuteman Civil Defense Corps uphold our nation’s laws, sir! We do not stand above them! And you cannot show otherwise! And that must be why you do not substantiate your claims in your opinion piece—because you CANNOT!
Your slanders are WITHOUT ANY BASIS IN FACT!
As an appointed officer of the State of Washington, Mr. Brenman must be held accountable for his vicious public accusations and publicly retract them in WRITTEN form. HE WORKS FOR ALL THE *CITIZENS* OF THIS STATE AND NOT JUST THOSE WHO HOLD HIS POLITICAL VIEWS!
We have been deeply and unjustly maligned by Mr. Brenman and deserve a public apology from him printed in the very publication in which he made such unjust and outrageously false accusations about our Organization or we will pursue every legal option available to us to secure our satisfaction in this matter!
Will you issue a written public apology to our organization to be published on the HeraldNet online news service, Mr. Brenman, or do you refuse?
Please respond immediately.
With greatest concern,
Signed the men and women of the Washington State Chapter of the Minuteman Civil Defense Corps.
Food for thought, I encourage all to research if they are interested and discuss. Also, don't throw around the repugnant "Nazi" label so much. It is distasteful and rather pathetic if it is found not to be true. Have fun!!
Did you
Submitted by Sarah on Sun, 08/19/2007 - 7:41am.Did you check this out? You know, the link to the 5 part extensively researched series that I listed before?
Closet Nazis hate being
Submitted by Mary Baker Eddy on Sun, 08/19/2007 - 9:30am.Ok, they're Fascists
Submitted by Summerisle on Sun, 08/19/2007 - 8:32pm.This is a photo of a group of minutemen,
Submitted by Rob Richards on Sun, 08/19/2007 - 12:35am.Rather interesting salute, there
Submitted by Anonymously Larry on Sun, 08/19/2007 - 12:40pm.Vincent:
I'm sure your heart was in the right place, attempting to make sure that innocent people are not slurred needlessly, but the picture submitted of the "Minutemen" certainly supports the "1,000 words" theory.
One of the best defenses by extreme groups is the lawsuit or threat of same. It is a deflecting technique to attempt to put the focus on others.
As to Equal Rights Commissions - I have a personal history there. When I lived in Tacoma, about 13 years ago, I had a house that had a private room with bath that I rented to college students at UPS. They had access to my home, but their own privacy as desired.
When it was vacant, I had an application from an African American woman with a small child, that was living in the YWCA Women's Shelter. My wife and I decided to give her a try, as she seemed very much in need and had State assistance to pay her bills. The first night she was there, she left after we went to bed, leaving the child behind. I addressed her the next day, telling her that behavior was inappropriate and we could not tolerate it. That night she did it again. A music associate of mine later told me that he saw her that night in a club partying.
The next day, I prepared her personal goods and had a taxi pick her up and take her back to the Women's Shelter - out of my pocket. I did not refund her rent as she had caused me to lose revenue that could have been made from another person that was reliable.
A week later, I received a letter from the Tacoma Human Rights Commission that she had filed a complaint against me, saying that I had used racial slurs and had denied her housing because of her race. Needless to say, totally bogus.
Complaints filed are not necessarily true and warranted, but they do work as a deflecting tool.
"There is only one race, the human race" - The Neville Brothers
How did that complaint turn out?
Submitted by jlw on Sun, 08/19/2007 - 10:52pm.end of an era...
Submitted by chad360 on Sun, 08/19/2007 - 12:00pm.While I am looking forward to the new Olympic Cards & Comics game room, I am >bummed< that Hasbro has moved Dragon magazine online, and online only...along with Dungeon...
My copy of the last print of each magazine showed up this month, 'bout the same time as Hasbro/WotC came 2 da decision to re-vamp the rules yet once again from version 3.5 to 4.0 >lame<
I remember the original Advanced Dungeons & Dragons, and seek to preserve that nostalgic flavor in the games I play in, and I glad that the Open Game concept exists.
Instead of buying into a corporate ploy to garner more capital from gamers, I'm gonna convert the information in the original game to the open d20 system, and I'm sure my posse of game-phreaks will gobble it up...
...still >sigh<
This really is "an end of an era" for me that started in 1977,
Farewell Dragon, I loved thee!
yours truly,
Martynn Alixander Wohndyr, the Trickster-Prince of Mora (and many other personaes, too numerous to name)
What can I say??
Submitted by vincent_vega on Sun, 08/19/2007 - 9:20pm.Absolutely!
Submitted by Anonymously Larry on Mon, 08/20/2007 - 12:57am.I get pissed as hell when I see property distruction by so called "environmentalist" causes.
As I've learned since posting in here - less focus on the label, more focus on the action.
"There is only one race, the human race" - The Neville Brothers
about those minutemen
Submitted by ctqwn on Sun, 08/19/2007 - 11:04pm.in the photo posted earlier--They look like they could be in AZ, or some other border area where various Minutemen groups have been involved in vigilante type "border patrols". The Southern Poverty Law Center monitors groups like them, and they would be a good source of info for anyone wanting more details. Closer to home, a Minuteman group in OR made the news some months back:
[OR] Minutemen Rally for Stricter Driver's License Regulations Salem Stateman-Journal / May 13, 2007 About 40 people rallied Saturday in South Salem in support of setting stricter rules on how the state issues driver's licenses. The rally, organized by the Oregon chapter of the Minuteman Civil Defense Corps in cooperation with Oregonians for Immigration Reform, saw residents holding signs and American flags on the sidewalk in front of the Oregon Driver and Motor Vehicles Services office. A scuffle broke out about noon when a man walked into the crowd and started protesting against the Minutemen.
Unfortunately, it seems the term "minutman" ain't what it used to be.
Some of the folks who came
Submitted by Rob Richards on Mon, 08/20/2007 - 12:13am.Are we talking about the
Submitted by Norm on Mon, 08/20/2007 - 7:58am.I'm not sure about who the
Submitted by ctqwn on Mon, 08/20/2007 - 10:14am.I'm not sure about who the local minuteman group is, but a common tactic in recent years has been for racist/hate groups to present themselves as Christians, patriots, and other mom-and-apple-pie-lovin' folks. Just as the concept of a "citizen militia" was co-opted by the kind of peope who supported and helped Tim McVeigh, it seems the minuteman concept has also been taken over by nativist-racist types. Again, the Southern Poverty Law Center is a good source of info. In a recent article called "Christian Nativism", they had this to say:
"The Secure Borders Coalition is where the religious right meets and meshes with the extreme end of anti-immigrant politics. An alliance of Christian Right groups, hard-right organizations like Accuracy in Media and the Swift Boat Veterans, and strident but secular anti-immigration outfits such as the Minuteman Civil Defense Corps, the coalition in June issued a strong statement opposing all amnesty and guest worker proposals. It vowed to oppose any candidate, regardless of his or her stance on other issues, who does not toe the line on immigration. Remarkably, it also calls for a near-freeze in legal immigration. "
And it goes to say:
"One possible future for this nexus can be glimpsed in the budding relationship between two Secure Border Coalition members -- a relationship that links religious-right political muscle to the literal muscle of the vigilante border-patrol movement. Last spring, Chris Simcox put his Minuteman Civil Defense Corps (MCDC) under the wing of Alan Keyes' Declaration Alliance, a group dedicated to overturning Roe v. Wade that also believes in a "founding mandate to freely and publicly acknowledge the authority of the Creator God." Along with imbuing the Simcox group with a touch of the divine, the MCDC/Keyes arrangement saw Simcox's mailing lists handed over to Response Unlimited, a Keyes-connected Christian mailing and telemarketing firm that now sells lists of MCDC donors for $120 per thousand names."
Here's a link to the full article for anyone who's interested: http://www.splcenter.org/intel/intelreport/article.jsp?pid=1313
I guess the question we need
Submitted by Norm on Mon, 08/20/2007 - 11:31am.Seems like it isn't. It's
Submitted by Norm on Sun, 08/19/2007 - 11:45pm.