What some humans do

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What some humans do

Submitted by Sarah on Tue, 09/11/2007 - 6:31am.

I just want to say that this story (warning - graphic news story) really profoundly disturbs me. I read the initial report last night and didn't sleep very well afterwards. This is so wrong on so many levels, what was done to this young woman.

I grew up being taught definitions of evil. As a young adult I decided there was no such thing as evil and I would have given you some esoteric confused reasoning as to how I sorted that out. Now I'm older.

I'm lighting a candle today for the survivor. For all survivors.

Sarah's blog
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Rambling thoughts.

Submitted by Tschida on Tue, 09/11/2007 - 7:57am.

There is unqualified evil in the world. It comes from every where from every background and it has always been there. I hate it. We hear about it from time to time, as it makes the news. Slowly our society is changing from a neighborly open friendly and welcoming environment into a suspicious and frightening place to live. I long for a time when this is not the case but we have a society where we can trust our neighbors.

I oppose the death penalty, as I think it not a punishment any longer, as much as it is a convenient solution for the government and a source of a kind of retribution (for better or worse) for the victim’s survivors. I do think that our current prison/jail system should be changed to make it a place where you are punished, and in certain cases rehabilitated. Being put to sleep like the family cat is not punishment, it serves no worthwhile cause, and it totally irreversible if you execute the wrong person. We should punish evil severely, without question. We should not waste time with executions.

I must say this is one area were I would like to see the United States be more in line with our international neighbors.

One of the great non sequiturs of the left is that, if the free market doesn't work perfectly, then it doesn't work at all-- and the government should step in.

Thomas Sowell

I hear ya

Submitted by Sarah on Tue, 09/11/2007 - 8:21am.

Especially chilling to know that this one story represents so many other stories that are not told.

Oh My Gosh

Submitted by JstPlnOnry on Tue, 09/11/2007 - 8:10am.

What happens in a persons head to make them do such sick & vile things? I just don't get it. I hope those 4 are punished to the fullest extent of the law. And I will keep that young woman and her family in my prayers.

DESPICABLE.

JstPlnOnry

"Do not mistake for conspiracy and intrigue what can best be explained by stupidity and incompetence." - Unknown

What created these people?

Submitted by Guglielmo on Tue, 09/11/2007 - 11:19am.

What are their nightmares like?

I don't agree with the idea

Submitted by Rob Richards on Tue, 09/11/2007 - 12:38pm.

I don't agree with the idea that the world is a dangerous place or that we can't trust our neighbors, but these people are seriously troubled.

....but these people are

Submitted by Norm on Tue, 09/11/2007 - 1:02pm.

....but these people are seriously troubled.

Bit of an understatement don'tcha think? The world may not be a dangerous place, I certainly won't blame people for preparing for the worst though.

Of course it's an

Submitted by Rob Richards on Wed, 09/12/2007 - 3:39pm.

Of course it's an understatement, humans don't make words to describe this kind of thing because these kinds of actions are outside of human nature.

Preparing for the worst, in my opinion is the problem with our society, too busy "protecting our freedom", which "they" "hate us for" to spend time getting to know our neighbors, which where true safety will come from.

That said, people can do what they want, I wouldn't pass a law to stop them if I could. I certainly do discourage them from thinking that way any chance I get though.

I hold a stone in my hand

There will always be evil

Submitted by Mary Baker Eddy on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 6:54am.

There will always be evil people and evil things. This story has me very upset; I don't know what bothers me more; seeing the picture of the little girl and knowing what has been wasted and destroyed or imagining the screams and terror and wondering who in God's name could do something like this.

That story is why I firmly

Submitted by Norm on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 8:37am.

That story is why I firmly believe in capital punishment. Anyone who can do that needs to be removed from the gene pool.

Capital punishment...

Submitted by Tschida on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 8:57am.

Why is laying someone down on a clean soft bed, hooking them up to an IV solution of saline and letting them say what ever they want to the victims survivors, and then simply be sedated, and then put to sleep, a punishment at all? They are simply going to sleep and not waking up. This of course after they have languished in prison, watching television, wasting literally millions of dollars of tax payer money, reading books, sometimes giving commencement speeches at colleges to graduates, and generally doing nothing productive.How is this any sort of punishment? It is a pathetic waste of money and time. C.One of the great non sequiturs of the left is that, if the free market doesn't work perfectly, then it doesn't work at all-- and the government should step in. Thomas Sowell

Jumping to conclusions

Submitted by Norm on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 9:21am.

my words were broad for a reason. Think about it.

I'm just against execution

Submitted by Guglielmo on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 9:07am.

but I can certainly see why people have the urge to do it.

I agree Guglielmo...

Submitted by Tschida on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 9:14am.

It is easy for me to understand the visceral desire to see a killer executed. But when you think about it, I find for me that it is not a punishment at all. Further you can release an innocent man from jail but you can't really bring back a dead man and say 'oops sorry'. I am however also against this languishing in prison doing nothing but reading and watching television, lifting weights, and giving speeches. I am all for the 'hard labor' and boot camp rehab stuff. One of the great non sequiturs of the left is that, if the free market doesn't work perfectly, then it doesn't work at all-- and the government should step in. Thomas Sowell

The question of evil

Submitted by Nanci on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 11:40am.

In Eichmann in Jerusalem, Hannah Arendt speaks to the banality of evil - she clearly points out that the Holocaust happened because ordinary people in their ordinary lives, ignored what was taking place. While others simply followed orders (That was Eichman's arguement - he wasn't guilty because he was simply following Hitler's order for the final solution). I truly believe as long as we ordinary people ignore the racism, sexism, heterosexism, etc etc in the everyday covert actions of ourselves, our community and our institutions, we will inevitably continue to see the horror, harm and damage it creates.

Who is ignoring?

Submitted by Tschida on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 11:53am.

Who is ignoring racism sexism etc? Some people don't hold it as their first and foremost agenda, but I don't think anyone ignores it. So who are you talking about?

One of the great non sequiturs of the left is that, if the free market doesn't work perfectly, then it doesn't work at all-- and the government should step in.

Thomas Sowell

There are many people who

Submitted by Guglielmo on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 12:03pm.

do nothing. They just keep their heads down. I imagine that is what she is talking about.

I was at a local bar this weekend and one guy at another table was talking about how much he hates (insert racial epithet here)s. People just tittered uncomfortably. They were obviously uncomfortable, but no one at his table was able to step up and say what needed to be said. That's an example of ignoring something rather blatant and offensive. There are many instances of more subtle and "acceptable" behaviors that are more easily ignored.

Yeah I'm a bit surprised

Submitted by Norm on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 1:02pm.

Yeah I'm a bit surprised that nobody told him to keep his inner thoughts to himself earlier than that. Of course I'm the kind of guy who is spit at, so I shouldn't be shocked right?

Yo G,

Submitted by Rob Richards on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 1:08pm.

That was a perfect example, I wish I had been there, I would have had him thrown out.

I hold a stone in my hand

I'm reluctant to send people to banned camp

Submitted by Guglielmo on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 1:20pm.

but I did finally say "dude, this isn't your living room and I'd rather not hear that kind of talk."

I am willing to bet...

Submitted by Norm on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 1:23pm.

that silently you had a fair number of people thanking you.

good for you

Submitted by Rob Richards on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 1:27pm.

People should look at the name on the sign before they walk in to the place. It doesn't have the word "Aryan" in front of it.

I hold a stone in my hand

I think it's funny, in a sad

Submitted by Mary Baker Eddy on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 1:49pm.

I think it's funny, in a sad pathetic way, that White Supremacists refer to themselves as Aryans. The original Aryans were an Indo-Iranian culture.

yeah

Submitted by Rob Richards on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 2:20pm.

Literally the word means noble.

It's actual meaning is antithetical to the Nazi's use of it. They literally took a word and redefined it to mean the exact opposite of what it originally meant.

I hold a stone in my hand

Wow that's deep.

Submitted by Norm on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 4:19pm.

Wow that's deep.

yeah

Submitted by Rob Richards on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 5:26pm.

It's kind of like what the neo-cons have done to the word freedom.

I hold a stone in my hand

You mean

Submitted by Norm on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 5:34pm.

You mean freedom....underneath a tight thumb?

Exactly

Submitted by Rob Richards on Thu, 09/13/2007 - 5:43pm.

You have freedom of speech, but only in this predetermined zone.

You have the freedom to own guns, but you have to do it like this.

I hold a stone in my hand

Of course you can offer some example...

Submitted by Tschida on Fri, 09/14/2007 - 10:30am.

Of course you can offer some example of how your freedom of speech was curtailed. Right?

One of the great non sequiturs of the left is that, if the free market doesn't work perfectly, then it doesn't work at all-- and the government should step in.

Thomas Sowell

A recent example I can think

Submitted by Mary Baker Eddy on Fri, 09/14/2007 - 10:40am.

A recent example I can think of was the Capitolitarians designating the area next to the Porta-Potties as a free speech zone. (I thought the entire United States was a free speech zone.)

Then there was the 85 year old woman told by OPD and The Olympian that she couldn't distribute flyers at the Oly Center.

In both cases the City stepped up and said that wasn't right.

This wasn't the same as a century ago when the National Guards of various states including Washington would gun down strikers and their families, but it was still an attempt at suppression.

yeah, what she said!

Submitted by Rob Richards on Fri, 09/14/2007 - 11:05am.

Free speech zones are common all over the US and are a violation of the rights the government said they would allow us.

I hold a stone in my hand

And try wearing a "Stop the War" t-shirt

Submitted by Guglielmo on Fri, 09/14/2007 - 11:13am.

at a George Bush "town hall" meeting.

Or a shirt with a swastika

Submitted by Norm on Fri, 09/14/2007 - 11:29am.

Or a shirt with a swastika on it to a Jewish function?

Or a shirt with the Star of

Submitted by Mary Baker Eddy on Fri, 09/14/2007 - 11:35am.

Or a shirt with the Star of David in Coeur d'Alene?

Ooooh! or taking your trusty

Submitted by Norm on Fri, 09/14/2007 - 11:41am.

Ooooh! or taking your trusty pitchfork in with you to church.

Or

Submitted by Rob Richards on Fri, 09/14/2007 - 12:00pm.

taking your 30 year old girlfriend to the NAMBLA convention.

A Jewish Function

Submitted by Guglielmo on Fri, 09/14/2007 - 11:44am.

sounds like it is a private function. Freedom of speech is not protected in those cases. But when the president is speaking at a public venue, I'd say it is a much different matter.

=P how about a "public"

Submitted by Norm on Fri, 09/14/2007 - 11:47am.

=P how about a "public" Jewish function? You are putting a cramp in my fun-vent.

Then the authorities would probably remove you

Submitted by Guglielmo on Fri, 09/14/2007 - 12:00pm.

because your shirt could very likely incite serious violence. As you know, you cannot yell "fire" in a crowded theater. I seriously doubt that an anti-war t-shirt at a town hall meeting would be considered a serious danger to public safety.

It's funny I was told the

Submitted by Norm on Fri, 09/14/2007 - 12:03pm.

It's funny I was told the same thing about my "Caterpillar" sweatshirt in downtown Oly

FYI

Submitted by Norm on Fri, 09/14/2007 - 12:13pm.

and everyone elses, I'm just throwing things out that I find odd. Not really being terribly serious. I'm contemplating starting a thread regarding 2nd amendment and government restrictions toward it though.

Yeah

Submitted by Sarah on Fri, 09/14/2007 - 12:23pm.

Go for it.

I know the fun vent is open,

Submitted by Mary Baker Eddy on Fri, 09/14/2007 - 12:00pm.

I know the fun vent is open, but swastikas at a Jewish event wouldn't be all that funny.

Agreed

Submitted by Sarah on Fri, 09/14/2007 - 12:03pm.

Norm and/or G. man, I have a mission for you. Start a blog thread that is a fun-vent. You gotta provide a definition too.

I'm on it

Submitted by Guglielmo on Fri, 09/14/2007 - 12:09pm.

...the fun vent, that is. Wait...that didn't sound right.

Yeah yeah

Submitted by Sarah on Fri, 09/14/2007 - 12:11pm.

Quick, we need a fun vent for the front page.

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